AlbionTV interview with Robin Henkys

Transcript (by Youtube)

7s	[Music] what's up guys it's lupac here from albian TV I am here in Berlin for a week I'm at
13s	the sandbox interactive offices and I'm very very lucky to be bringing you guys with the rest of the
18s	team a series of interviews exclusive interviews with developers and other people from within the
25s	company this one will be someone that you're very familiar with someone who's been on camera plenty
31s	and I believe I might even be sitting in his chair it is of course Mr Robin Hanes himself a pleasure
39s	to see you um and the first time we've sat down like this I think we've had we've had meetings
45s	and we've had you on my live stream many years ago we've never had an interview I don't think we've
51s	never sat down in the set and had an interview now you obviously you know you are the CEO of sandbox
58s	interactive and your journey through the company you start you started as a developer well I mean
65s	I I'm CEO and game director and out of those two titles I always consider the game director the
72s	more important title because um yeah I joined originally as lead designer for albian online
79s	I'm not a founding member of the company as many people uh might think but I actually they assume
86s	but I actually joined about a year and a half after the initial team had started on the project
93s	but I came in to kind of guide the very early project into some kind of Direction where it would
101s	actually turn out to be a game because because initially it was a technical prototype yeah it
106s	had you know it had a vision for what it wanted to be from a sort of core gameplay Direction but
114s	it needed somebody to take those ideas and like really shape it into a playable game and that was
121s	my task initially and then obviously that became a lot more over the years yeah and we we've talked
127s	at length about the size of the company then the size of the company now and there's obviously
134s	been significant challenges as the company grows thing not necessarily challenges but things work
141s	differently as a company grow or triples in size essentially I mean that's I think anybody who's
146s	like been in a company like that or who has had a company like that uh has run a company like that
153s	um experiences those stages of growth right like we started out like before I join there was really
159s	just a few people less than 10 people I think I'm employee number 13 that's a phase where you can
164s	still talk to everybody like regularly every day and um then you go into a phase where maybe like
172s	20 30 people you have some Department structures but really like everybody's still very tight and
178s	then obviously as that keeps growing you have to change how you're working you're you know more
184s	and more and more is becoming independent you have units that maybe don't talk to each other
188s	at all anymore yeah so you have to think about how do you still keep them connected and in sync and
194s	all of that so yeah growing and growing a game and growing a company is a very challenging process
200s	and as a CEO obviously you've got to you have got to be business-minded now but I've always seen you
207s	as a Game Dev that became the CEO and heart you are still game focused and player focused and
213s	does that sometimes clash with when you have to be business CEO versus the game CEO yeah I mean
219s	it constantly clashes right like I I mean I I got into video games to make games to make games yeah
226s	uh and like actually funny story when I originally got into video games I didn't think about why I'm
231s	doing it I just did it and then at some point when you finish your degree people start asking
236s	you where do you want to go like where do you want to take this and then started thinking
240s	about that and my dream back then was I was like one day I want to be the guy that talks about
246s	the game that he's worked on and obviously that's worked out in the de talks that dream is fulfilled
253s	um you want my job at you talk guy pretty much no but like obviously there's a big conflict or or
261s	there's some conflict in being just about the game and then being about the business but I've always
267s	seen it that you know projects like this games like this you cannot make without a lot of money
275s	right like you have large teams lots of people working working on these plus actually I don't
282s	people probably underestimate the cost of like technically running these games right yeah live
288s	service games with with the server infrastructure yeah with like a significant server infrastructure
292s	but not only that with all the the special networking connections traffic Etc that you
299s	have to pay for there's a lot of of you know that a pretty hefty operation behind albn online now
305s	so I try to basically separate these things pretty hard and like when I'm in the design and Direction
311s	mode I'm not in the business mode and when I'm CEO mode I have to think about the business of
316s	course yeah we've sort of said as well you know I tged on the fact that you guys have essentially
321s	more than tripled in size since I've been first involved withing online and is there one thing
327s	that Springs to mind that that change that maybe you didn't expect or you you would never have seen
333s	coming like is there a big the biggest difference that maybe you didn't anticipate when growing what
340s	was a big Advantage for us in in building this game was that in the core team we had a lot of
346s	people who happen to have the right experience so I had kind of seen both developments on a
355s	very small scale and developments on a pretty big scale with over 100 people and you know
362s	in the art Department Code Department we had people that were you know very experienced when
367s	they started this project that had seen a lot of things so not a lot of things like fundamentally
372s	surprised us about this I guess the only thing that was surprising is how challenging it still
379s	was despite kind of knowing what would happen if you scale up and you know it it's just challenging
385s	it's it's challenging to get away from sort of tight monolithic structures that you've built
392s	that are very very efficient where you where where you're centralizing the decision-making process
397s	to be fast but then obviously as you're scaling up you can't just rely on the same shoulders to carry
405s	the entire weight so a big thing that's happening at sandbox over the last years is that more and
411s	more and more work becomes distributed amongst teams um there's more autonomous units working
417s	on particular parts of the game and I think that is absolutely the correct thing because it also
424s	means that we're we're capitalizing on the diverse ideas that are in the team right like yeah more
432s	people more ideas brought this up a few time now times now but for example a hot editor I
437s	don't think that's something that would have um sprung up if we you know keep controlling
442s	everything that that's happening in the game from a central perspective that only kind of
447s	happens if if one team takes the initiative and say says you know we know this is a lot of work
451s	but we're willing to take it on now I do like to sit down everyone I've ever sat down with from SBI
456s	you know have a few I have a few questions that give me an insight into the person and the gamer
461s	because we're all Gamers at heart that's that's why we're here that's why we do what we do now I
466s	don't I feel it's a very harsh term I don't like the term yellow zone Warrior because I feel that
473s	it sends the wrong message but I have heard this term banded about a little bit and I'm not you
480s	know I'm not labeling you Robin but I would like you to tell me the type of albian player you are
486s	I mean obviously we there's there's always the question do the deaths play so I mean obviously I
491s	play less album than I would like to um that just to get that out there um the reality is that like
498s	playing in a guild which I think for me would be the ideal way of playing albian it's not really
505s	accessible to me because I don't have room for the commitment between work and the family you're not
510s	secretly in a guild then you uh I'm not currently no um not saying that we haven't done that in the
516s	past I know I know i' I've someone might have a shot caller that works at SBI they never know
522s	no but like like for like over the course of the production for the majority of that period I've
528s	I've been kind of the solo albian player which I think um is not the ideal way to to play albian
536s	in many ways because there's obviously a lot of Social and components that's really interesting
541s	though but then you've seen the solo improvements over the years because launch albian was you kind
549s	of had to get into a guild to do the majority of content versus albian now you could never touch
555s	guilds and you probably won't run out of things to do yeah and it actually like I found myself
561s	being more stuck in particular like like actually sticking to the game for extended periods to play
566s	a particular content I mean what what we do is we have regular de nights where we where we play then
572s	maybe Arenas to train some I've he as well it can get heated we have some people who are much
579s	better and some people that are on a kind of lower experience level so where would you rate yourself
585s	oh I'm definitely being car 10 as a pvper oh I'm terrible no I'm terrible yeah so I come from a
593s	shooter background right I'm I'd say I'm decent at Shooters when I was started my career as a game
599s	def away as an amateur you made a halflife mod I made a half lifee one mod yeah and like obviously
604s	one back then one was consuming everything that was there like all the mods and actually I feel
610s	that that that was a huge inspiration to my career because mods back then and probably today still
619s	are such a creative space where so much is going on and obviously we we uh owe quite a lot of games
627s	nowadays to moders that have yeah I mean some games survive invented genres essentially yeah
633s	and so that was your that was your little uh that was my kind of I mean I wasn't involved in any of
637s	those big ones but I that was the world I was initially active in but um anyway back to being
645s	me as an albian player so yeah I'm I'm if I'm in PvP I can execute things that I'm being told to
652s	do so I'm probably like a good person to follow a shot caller but I would not be the person to call
660s	any shots in a zvz what's been really interesting is you know the guilds have their own strategies
666s	their own Styles there's also Trends between servers different regions have a different play
672s	style and I noticed this in 5V FS when we ran the tournaments like the Asian 5v5 play style
677s	was different to the Western but for the bigger battles you know which is the meat of albian for a
682s	lot of players since the foundations update it has felt very much more battle you know cuz it's it's
689s	a centralized like Siege you know it feels like you're in a fight and that that's really a lot of
694s	players have loved to see that and see it happen that's personally been my favorite update of the
701s	recent ones that was that was a big game share especially for Albi and TV and the war report
706s	now you know we run late every day because it just doesn't stop they just don't stop fighting that's
713s	lovely to hear because I mean obviously they're taking sort of a bet on foundations which which
719s	was we want to do something to show our commitment to guilt Warfare to like territory Warfare as a
729s	big thing in albian online after we' done quite a lot of more solo focused updates I think that's
735s	that's been one of the main challenges for us when we've been designing updates is obviously we have
739s	a new schedule we want to be fast we want to do something per season um but we also have such a
746s	wide audience from like hardcore guilds that are playing for the season wins to more casual guilds
753s	that are you know playing the season but not necessarily to win all the way to very casual
758s	guilds with just a few friends trying to do this thing or that thing and then all the way
762s	to solo players which then again go into like more casual solo players or then the hardcore PVP mist
769s	or whatever you do as you know there's there's a very wide range of players and I'm probably even
775s	ignoring all the economics yeah there's players that don't even leave town it's very very hard to
782s	reach all those players with every update which is why we're not even trying to do that anymore
788s	like we're trying to do like one important thing for one group you'll you'll see that I think with
793s	the higher update frequency that more often than not uh a topic will be started in One update and
799s	then continued in the next update and obviously like the fortifications from foundations that's
805s	a topic that we also essentially started in foundations um and that we are looking forward
812s	to picking up again at some point and kind of continue on on making these battles even more
818s	exciting because we left out an entire part of sieges yeah um which was you know Siege engines
823s	or more ways of besieging territory but we felt that we first wanted to get an idea of how people
830s	receive this how people play this so we couldn't just immediately follow up we needed time to
836s	observe so that's something we hope to get around to um but actually what's happening right now is
842s	we're as we're reaching kind of the end of our push to make the open world more playable for for
851s	um solo players we are right now kind of sorting all the different topics that we have for 2025 and
858s	in the decision- making process for what's going to get priority phase is complete like the albian
863s	Cinematic Universe you know that that phase it will be completed with the next update that you
869s	nothing about yet sorry but um which will be revealed in due time um but as that's going on
878s	we're also already of course thinking about like what will be the focus of the next uh sort of push
885s	and there's a lot of things um that are obviously competing for attention of course if we're talking
891s	bigger picture what we've just started with Horizons is to take a look at PVE and like we said
900s	we need to if we ever want to have challenging PVE in the game again not just in in hardcore
906s	Expeditions but like an actual like uh open world play we need to set a new Baseline for where they
913s	where they are in a challenge level and then that's for us the foundation to go on to think
919s	about more PVE content down the line then we have of course unfinished business when it comes to
929s	the awakened weapons where a lot of people are asking when will we get the legendary weapons
934s	um The Guild season for us is always unfinished there will always be updates to to that so there's
941s	a lot of topics um that are currently kind of so it's not always about brand new content it's
950s	about you know you don't just deliver for example the foundations and tick it off you're constantly
957s	monitoring it and trying to make it the best it can be as a feature which is nice because
963s	nobody likes their favorite content to feel like it's been abandoned if that makes sense yeah I
969s	mean it's it's always a balance right so if we if we talk about the game updates what role do the
973s	game updates play um the game updates fulfill two roles one they need to keep the current
979s	player base entertained and show that you know we have we we're looking at the issues that the game
986s	has right now and you know in a game of this scale everything's going to Happ issues in some way some
991s	issues are bigger some issues are smaller like for example I'm sure people are asking why haven't
995s	they done anything about hell Gates why haven't they done anything about corrupted dungeons why
999s	haven't they done anything about Crystal League you know there's all these topics and it's not
1002s	that we're aware not aware of them but actually like the right solutions to these topics um are
1009s	actually often more challenging than the original implementation yeah right because you now have to
1015s	take into account the players that are actually liking certain aspects of your current gamepl so
1019s	you have to kind of consider do you keep it intact you know and also when everyone moves to a certain
1025s	content they're not doing something else which then takes it so so we're aware of all of these
1031s	and we're always debating the best Solutions and when we come to a point where we're like okay we
1039s	really feel that we have a good solution for this topic now that's when we'll typically jump on it
1045s	and say okay let's schedule that in the in in the road map and we are currently I think we
1050s	are collecting a number of cool solutions for for various things that are under discussion for being
1056s	scheduled the um the other side is that an update also always has the role to reactivate people to
1064s	to get to either acquire new players but also to to reactivate older players to get them to
1070s	check out the game again and say hey look Alban's changed quite a bit so we always have to strike
1074s	a balance between making an update um good for existing players but also attractive for people to
1080s	join the game to continue to grow the game because obviously their goal is to make sure that albian
1086s	is still a game people played 10 years down the line exactly and I I I love the you know I love
1092s	the fact that we're now syncing up the update with the season start because as you said new players
1098s	return or so new players join and old players return and they've got a new update but also
1104s	they've got a fresh season they're not joining and being like well there's no point playing The
1108s	Guild season CU this guilds already won you know that everything is like right let's let's go on a
1114s	cycle let's get into the season and there's a lot like the upsides and downsides to that right like
1121s	the the upside is definitely what you're saying I think it it's just a moment that makes a lot of
1126s	sense there's a lot that we could do with this timing in the future where we could do changes
1131s	per season and stuff like that the downside is in reality that actually doesn't leave a whole lot
1136s	of development time for us because our typical schedule is in that sort of three month cycle
1142s	is about two months development and then one month of just making sure that everything that
1146s	we touched in changed isn't broken and you know gets the approval for being rolled out from all
1152s	the different platforms that we are hosting it on and so there's a lot of um overhead actually
1158s	for each release of of such a big version and actually a pretty short development cycle in
1163s	each update that the team really has to make the best of considering the quality of them it really
1167s	is and I think a lot of players probably don't realize that when you update your game it has to
1173s	basically be reauthorized on these app stores even though it's already there it counts as a as a new
1178s	product essentially to them yeah I mean that's something that has to happen for every patch
1183s	essentially yeah so got a few quick fire questions for you then you know just don't overthink it just
1190s	the first thing that comes to your head okay so favorite update uh Queen favorite weapon
1200s	claws weirdly oh okay okay I like the sound effect of claws it's very STIs it's just the first weapon
1207s	that I fall in love with at some point and then like it it hasn't worked for me in the game but
1213s	it's still like First Love okay most memorable moment in the game there's there's several um
1220s	I think like opening the floodgates and seeing the players come in and just like day one is obviously
1227s	very me memorable um in of like favorite moments uh I think like every time I go into a city and
1234s	see everybody going about their business yeah and it feels like an MMO feeling that
1239s	energy of everybody's at the market everybody's repairing everybody's doing stuff like that is my
1245s	favorite thing about album because the goal was a player driven world with lots of activity and
1249s	that's what you can see in the cities yeah now I've already bent your ear off this week about
1253s	things I'd love to see in albian I mean I get to live every player's dream really and like
1259s	find all the dead relevant people and tell them what I want to change in the game you know that
1263s	that's that's what every player wants um and I'm excited for the direction of the game uh
1269s	obviously the Albi and TV crew is excited for for broadcasting everything that we're doing in
1273s	the future and yeah it's been a pleasure to talk with you Robin has been a pleasure I'll see you
1278s	soon thank you for watching guys thank you for Robin joining us as always I'm lupac from albian
1283s	TV uh many more interviews coming here on the official albian YouTube channel of course you
1289s	can catch me and the guid at twitch.tv/ Alin online with a variety of shows see you soon
1310s	[Music]

Transcript (by Youtube)

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