Are pilot trees still a thing or has the idea been scrapped?
So Pilot Skills as previously implemented won’t be in for launch. We largely redesigned the components system to fit that need for power increases and build defining support stats. We may revisit this system in the future.
Oof, gut punch right there.
Hope skills come back in an expansion or something.
So we love skills and talent trees, they just weren’t as impactful and engaging as we had hoped. So if/when we reboot it we’re wanting to make it a little more rewarding.
Unlocks different things im guessing. Based on the demo, Pilot Level 2 unlocked a 2nd Javelin and level 4 (14?) unlocked 2nd Augment Slots. I want to say the 30 unlocked Grandmaster difficulty but I can't remember.
Yep all unlocks are gated by pilot level. In addition items scale based off level.
The pilot level is so that you don't have to start all the way from scratch leveling up each javelin; you can pick up better loot for all your javelins, even if you're not currently playing them.
Unless you could respec your pilot skills differently for each javelin, you could get stuck with a bunch of increased melee damage on your Storm, which would be much less useful than increased ability damage. And if you could respec for each javelin, you might as well have ability trees for each javelin (which actually sounds cool imo).
Pilot skill trees would just pidgeonhole you into specific javelins instead of being able to change stuff on the fly. That's why it's good to have all of the actual stats on the javelins themselves.
Pretty much this. Because they were pilot skills they had to be agnostic of Javelin (pick-up range, health pack drop rate, ammo drop rate). And because they were javelin agnostic well... they just weren’t that interesting or impactful. They didn’t change the way you play the game or your builds because they couldn’t by nature.
So instead we created the Javelin specific and Universal components. With 10 Jav specific ones they are much more focused on specific play styles and build changes that allow you to better customize.
Oof....
Man, you guys should probably have a sit down with your player investment lead and revisit this. While, on paper, absorbing the pilot skill tree into the component system may seem like a lateral movement. From an “RPG” aspect, you guys are effectively “removing” an avenue for player customization, in a genre where people obsess over wrinkles and nuances. Simply on principle, players want a character skill tree. Even if it’s totally for show. There is a psychological component to “tailoring” your pilot and distributing skill points as you see fit.
So I kind of spoke to it here https://reddit.com/r/AnthemTheGame/comments/anlasz/_/efuur5b/?context=1
But yes we totally understand, and we are already working on plans to revisit it and make it better. Not sure how far out we are from seeing it return (and in what form) but we do agree that a skill-tree type of system for customization and progression is important.
Extremely disappointed coming from an RPG lover. I understand your reasons and I don't fully agree with them.
You could have made the talent trees Javelin Specific.
You could have kept them regardless of it feeling a bit generic. I'd still have prefered this over having them on components. Now I'm gonna find that "item i been chasing" and then I will immediately be upset because it rolled "pick up radius" mod. A big let down in my opinion.
I think there may be some confusion about how exactly we incorporated these into the components. The tree wasn’t incorporated into components by adding those bonuses to the inscriptions (randomly rolled stats). Those always included things like luck or pickup radius and hasn’t changed. What changed is adding base benefits to components that specialize components like “gear does X% more damage but has Y% longer cooldowns”.
Sure there is the possibility that you won’t get the base stat component you want off the bat, but in practice as you level up you see a lot of not all of these pretty early. Then the supplemental crafting system allows you to invest how you want into those random inscriptions while keeping whatever base stat that changes your gameplay style.
Again we are looking at whether or not we can and want to bring something similar to a skill tree back, but having one that was full of stats or passives that didn’t marginally impact your gameplay felt empty.
Does that mean that the same item which gives 100 armor at pilot level 1 would give more than that at pilot level 30?
Yes it would
I see. Thanks for the clarification.
"base benefits of components that specialize components". This was a little confusing to read, but I hope i got the correct interpretation. So the entire component itself will basically be what the skill point was? And take up an entire component slot?
Do you think people will choose these components over the major ones that upgrade damage and defenses? I don't think so... This was not an issue before since they didn't compete slot wise.
My concern is that this will basically be lost and ignored since players likely will never choose those unless they have nothing else available.
For example. Let's say I have 6x component slots unlocked on my ranger:
Component 1: Assault Rifle component (assuming I use an assault rifle)
Component 2: Sniper Rifle component (assuming I use a sniper rifle)
Component 3: Shield/Armour/Health (maybe more than one taking 2 slots for example)
Component 4: Ultimate ability (idk if this is even a thing but im gonna assume there is one that affects ultimate..)
Component 5: Grenade (Lets say i use frost grenade, I'll pick a component that buffs frost grenade)
Component 6: Seeking missile component (Assuming im using seeking missile)
This leaves little to no space for components that had "perks" from the skill tree. I see every player just going for components that enhance their "main skills and gear".
Since you guys mentioned the perks from the skill tree were just very generic and not very impactful, what makes you think anyone will ever choose them for a component slot?
Yeah sorry that wasn’t worded very well. But yes essentially the more meaningful of the pilot skills were converted to components. The bonus of which is basically the sum of the full value of 5 points in that pilot skill previously. While you’re right you may take it less often, we also think that the options we added with components (specifically how they add to javelin specific builds) was much better for build diversity and customization.
In some situations you might take hover time over grenade damage because you want a hover build.
This is a huge mistake. Components alone can not fill the niche roll to make unique and impactful choices/builds. Its going to feel cookie cutter now. Also without the skill tree, the game can in no ways be considered an "rpg" of any sorts.
I guess I disagree. You have about 22 or 23 component choices in 6 slots which can drastically boost or alter your builds and gameplay. Versus agnostic pilot skills that never impacted your specific abilities or javelins.
For example there is a Colossus component that increases fire and electric damage. Combine that with the other Colossus component for combo and explosive damage. Seems much more impactful for your flamethrower and lightning coil build than pickup radius or ammo drop chance could ever be.
We know people like skill or talent trees, we do too. We want to revisit this in the future with a better design, more meaningful player choice, and more direct and engaging changes to you gameplay. The pilot skills as they were just didn’t do that.
All throughout the demo I knew my flight time was an issue. But I wasn't going to get the heatsink component because there were much more important things to have for combat. However, I KNEW, that when the game came out there would be a skill tree to address things across all Javelins, like flight time.
from https://www.ea.com/games/anthem/news/pilot-and-javelin-progression
"Pilot progression applies to every Javelin your pilot uses, and focuses on those aspects of being a pilot that aren’t tied to a specific Javelin. You can put points into flying for longer periods of time without overheating, allowing for greater mobility during combat, and fewer stops when traversing long distances, for example."
I also heard the same on a Bioware video.
This one person and one Anthem pre-order may not be a big deal to Bioware, but I feel like this is a bait and switch.
I’m sorry you feel that way, that’s not the intent. We want choice between abilities, gear, weapons, and boosts to you Javelins to be meaningful. A choice between a 5% increase to ammo count or a 5% increase to ammo drops didn’t feel like it was meeting that standard for us. If we can get something that satisfies that type of expectation for a talent or skill tree in a way that feels good, we’ll build it.
Bait and switch is a strong phrase when we are trying to be open and transparent during development, caveating that it’s a work in progress, and then making a change in our design decisions. Sorry it’s not what you had hoped for.
Why not have some creative skills that don't require one Javelin? Like losing X% HP will make you get a burst of speed? Or when you use an ability you get a small heal? Using a melee and ranged attack on the same enemy within five seconds will give you a shield? Stuff like that.
I think with slightly more time we may have been able to thoroughly rework the trees into more meaningful choices like this. Which is something we want to do now after launch.
Just to clarify, do you mean the drop of an item you got at level 5 would scale to still be usable at level 30, or would you need to obtain a new drop of the item (or craft the item) to get one with the values appropriate to your new level?
Sorry yes to clear that up, items do not scale with you. But if you had an item at level 1 that gave 10 armor, if you got another one of that same item type at 30 it would have an increased base stat value of something like 100 armor. (Not real values)
You would need a new drop or craft of it.
To spin this a bit further because it has me kinda worried. Since there will be no melee weapons and Interceptor is greatly focused around melee, how does my melee damage increase? For example if I have a green Deadeye and I equip a purple Deadeye, the puprle one will deal more damage. How can I increase my melee damage with no weapon slot to equip a better melee weapon? Or is it also tied to pilot level? Does my weapon gearscore also increase my melee damage? If not, how is it ensured that melee is viable for greater difficulties?
Melee, ultimate, and status effect damage you do scales based on your highest equipped power level item.
Based on your single highest, not your total power level... interesting (and good to know).
Right, it does mean that these will spike as soon as you get a big upgrade but it feels right so far. We’ll keep an eye on it though.
You have about 22 or 23 component choices in 6 slots which can drastically boost or alter your builds and gameplay.
Is that per Javelin or total across the board?
I guess what I meant is that without a "skill tree" you take away some of the flexibility people can have with builds outside of pure gear and the perks they provide. You can add some stats/perks etc where your current build may lack. They can also allow some flexibility for incomplete builds or allow someone to create something brand new. The more we have at our disposal the more creative we can get as players.
That’s per Javelin, there are 10 javelin specific components and I believe 12 or 13 universal components. So 12-13 shared and 10 unique to wa h javelin.
Based of just the power item level from the main stats of the weapon, just based of the power level, or based of both the power level and stats values?
Just the power level itself.
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