devtrackers.gg
After Drew’s Post I decided to see if the new update gives us better rewards or not. For those that can’t be bother reading all the calculation I will give a SPOILER ALERT…..
We get WORSE rewards now.
Essentially the things we lost compared to the new system evens out except one major thing. The new clan wars chest gives at best scenario -200 gold per day, and a realistic best case scenario of -1200 gold per day.
A few things to clarify. I am speaking from the point of view of a level 13 player who has been in an established but casual clan that is in Legendary League. We finished clan wars 1 with just over 24,000 war trophies. As such, we always got at least one and usually multiple first place finishes in clan wars every 2 weeks. This guaranteed the best clan war chest each time.
Now to run all the calculations I have converted everything into gold. This is done as follows:
Common Cards = 5 gold
Rares Cards = 50 gold
Epics Cards = 500 gold
Legendary Cards = 20,000 gold
The reason for the above is that whilst cards are all worth twice this amount in the shop, if you have maxed these out, this is the amount of gold you will actually receive for them. Also, if you want to trade out a maxed card for one you need, you will spend your token plus the amount above per card.
So if I want a legendary card, I ask for one I need, and offer one I have maxed out already. This will then cost me 20,000 gold plus the token. So this is why the above amounts have been used to calculate the gold conversion not what they are worth to buy in the shop.
These above figures are also used to calculate the minimum gold each chest is worth. In each case, I haven’t included the chance you can get a bonus epic or a bonus legendary. The calculated amount only includes 100% guaranteed cards.
Now I realise people won’t agree with me here but this is what I value Gems to be.
1 Gem = 275 gold.
This is actually a very high amount. I could make that 1 Gem = 200 gold and that would still be considered very high for some. However, this is the conversion I use when considering if I should spend Gems on continuing challenges or cashing out my prizes in the Global tournaments.
The best offer Supercel has ever offered in the shop involved spending 1000 gems and getting something like two Mega Lightning chests and some gold and tokens. At the time I calculated the deal to give 192 gold per gem spent.
For the sake of the calculations used here, I didn’t need to convert Tokens gained. However if I did need to do it they would be worth:
Legendary Token = 2000 gold
Epic Token = 1000 gold
Rare Token = 500 gold
Common Token = 250
The above amounts are the total gold you receive once you have 10 of each type of token and then receive another one.
OK so lets get to the nitty gritty. I will use Drew from Supercel’s format to see if things are better now or before, and you can decide for yourselves as some of this might be subjective. For those inclined you may wish to check my calculations as I have done these very late into the night/morning and typos or errors may have crept in.
Removed
Daily Gifts X3
NOTE on average a free chest nets you 233 gold. However there is always a chance for an epic, or even a legendary from this. Chance for a Legendary card from the free chest is currently 0.24%. It’s not much but we’ve all had it happen from time to time.
So the average not taking into effect chance of epics or legendary cards in the free chest is 3 x 320.75 = 963 (rounded up) / day.
Also Removed
Periodic Free Shop Gift
OK so I’ve assumed we got one of these prizes offered in the shop weekly. That is certainly the case with the Epic card, the rest I am not sure of. This means the 3,778 becomes 540 gold per day.
Adding the two removed methods above means we used to gain 963 + 540 = 1,504 gold per day from these.
So Drew has said the above prizes got replaced by the following.
This is where it gets tricky. It’s hard to know the likelihood of getting any of these (bar the epics that only occur once per week and what Drew said about gems (that we will all get 100gems per 30 days).
So the 30 day totals above include 4 days getting gems, and 4 and a bit days getting Epic Sunday epics.
So this means the remaining 22 days in those 30 days will give a random assortment between Common cards (500 gold), Rare (1,250), Gold Chest (1,165) or 1,500 gold. The Average from these is 1,104.
So in a 30 day cycle this means 1,104 x 22 + 27,500 + 10,714 = 62,502. This gives an average of 2,083 gold per day.
In summary the new system gains about 500 extra gold per day over the old system. However this is heavily weighted by the fact I use 275 gold per gem as my conversion. Many would lower this, and you’d find the gold gained per day figures of the before and after get much close to each other.
Removed From Old Clan Wars
Legendary League
On average I would have got around 2,000 – 2,500 gold per day doing card collection. Lets say 2,000 gold to be conservative and not taking into account the chances you sometimes get lots of gems.
As an example, if I won one card collection battle (500 gold) , the final war day (1,000 gold) and the clan came first (1,000 gold). Here is 2,500 gold. When you opened your war day chest the final item was a chance to either double your gold, or get between 10-50 gems or a token. This collection occurred once every 2 days.
Currently War Day Daily Gold
To be on par with above the old clan war, you must be able to win 2, 1v1 battles. You can roll your dice and try duels. If you win your duel you will get 3,500 gold however if you lose it you will only get 350 gold. Potentially you can win it and then get 1 or two more attacks and if you win those get yourself another 1,000 or 2,000 gold.
You could also choose to do the passive attacks that pretty much guarantee a win (ie repair the boat or attack someone else's boat) this will give you a guaranteed 500 gold (as all you need for this 500 gold is to do the simple task of destroying at least one of the towers). So 4 attacks of this = 2,000 gold per day guaranteed.
So you can take the risk, or you do the guarantee. Either way, I think the average is around 2000 gold per day and this is on par with the old clan war daily gold.
Now for QUESTS! I enjoyed these and never found it hard or a task to actually have to complete them. They simply got completed from normal play.
Removed
Quests 1 Per Day
This is tricky to calculate because each person had a chance to re-roll one quest each day. Most would try and re-roll until they got gems, or got one of those double rewards (ie 1,000 gold, 20 rares, 2 epics and occasionally you even got a 20 gems one).
I for example never collected common quest so I’ll take the 250 gold this represents out of the equation.
So lets say a typical week, I am able to re-roll the quests and I would get Gems only 1 time, the 1,000 gold quests 2 times, and 4 times I get the 500 gold quest. This will equal 6,750 gold. So this is close to 1,000 gold per day. I think this is being conservative since I know I got the Gems quest more than once per week simply by always re rolling quests to try and get it.
Verdict = 1,000 gold per day gained from daily quests.
Now this is the fun part. We also used to have the 41 day chest cycle attached to doing the quests.
Quest Chest Cycle = 9,850 Quest Points
Quest points per day = 35
Total quest cycle completed in 281.4 days
This means that the 41 chest cycle yields a minimum of 448,127 gold (not taking into account that you can gain extra epics or legendaries in the above chests). For example the odds of getting a legendary card from a magical chest is nearly 20%.
That 448,127 gold used to be earnt over 281.4 days. So this is an average of 1592 gold per day.
Verdict = Add this 1,592 gold with the 1,000 gold above gives around 2,600 gold per day that we used to get for quests and the quest chest cycle.
Drew also lumped the following in that we lost:
Also Removed
Old Clan Wars Chest
In Legendary League the old clan war chest for first place chest was worth 45,060 gold.
So the old war day chest was given once per 14 days. We got to battle for it 7 times. This guaranteed that our clan and many others got at least one first place finish during this time. From the moment we got to Legendary league, we never missed out on getting a first place legendary chest (I even kept all the screenshots of the collections).
So the old clan wars guaranteed an average of 3,219 gold per day from this chest.
Added with the 2,600 gold this makes 5,819 gold per day.
Verdict from all these things removed, we used to get a guaranteed 5,819 gold per day.
So the question is, what replaced all this?
Drew has said that the new clan wars chest that is given to us every 7 days (instead of every 14 days) replaces all this. However is this actually better?
Prizes in Legendary League are as follows:
So if the clan comes first or second every week the prizes are about the same. Averaging out a first or second place finish will equate to about 39,773 gold per week or 5,681 gold per day.
However if you throw in some third place finishes (I won’t even throw in fourth/fifth place ones) this drastically drops this amount.
Lets assume your clan is good and in three weeks you finish First once, Second once and Third Once. You get unlucky and you don’t get the legendary card from the third place chest (remember in all those quest chests above, I never included chances of getting extra epics or Legendary cards).
From this first, second and third clan placing you have earnt a total of 96,195 gold over 3 weeks or an average of 4,581 gold per day. This is a lot lower than the old guaranteed 5,819 gold per day.
So the unrealistic best case scenario is that your clan never finishes lower than second place or when it does finish third you get lucky and win the legendary card anyway….. At best this will get you around 5681 gold per day. This amount is far from guaranteed.
Even this best case scenario is actually worse than the old clan wars calculation that gave me a guaranteed 5819 gold per day.
So overall this system is WORSE. I think assuming a 3 week cycle of getting one first place, one second place and one third place is actually a best case scenario and even that means we get around 1,238 gold per day less from this scenario. In a normal scenario when your clan gets put in the river race in a “Group of death” match up, your clan could finish really low. It only takes one or two bad bad results per month to skew things to a much worse scenario than just losing 1,238 gold per day on average.
If you have read this far well done. What do you think of all this analysis? The rest of Drews’ post highlighted the monthly tournament and I didn’t see much difference from before, besides it always costs us Gems to get these rewards,
I did one of these a long time ago when the original clan wars replaced the clan chest. Back then Supercell was telling us the new rewards were better and myself and some others posted showing them how it actually wasn’t. They ended up revising things and giving us more. Hopefully they look at this post and do the same.
They may say that they will now compensate by giving more away in challenges but I’d rather the daily grind that never costs gems to do a continue, will at least be raised a bit to match or actually be better than the old system.
Also I actually want to thank Drew for his post. I think it shows that he cares about us and that he cares about the game. Drew’s post would have taken a long time to construct and many things were explained well and with details. This made my post easier to research.
EDIT I have had some very good comments question how I came to certain conclusions and I replied to some of you individually but I thought it is better I put it here too. Some of the calculations are a little subjective and so I will explain them further.
- How did I come up with this ridiculous conversion of each gem being worth 275 gold?
Answer: Each person can value gems to be whatever they want. I personally only ever spend them if I have a good chance or guarantee of getting a minimum of 275 gold per gem spent. I usually get more gold per gem spent than this. I have the pass on my main account, but my other account doesn't. In the last two challenges, I worked out that I got over 700 gold per gem spent for one, and 600 gold per gem spent for the other.
For example in the last challenge, in the final phase I lost after 3 wins. So I spent 25 gems for a continue and got the last 2 prizes (5,000 + 10,000 gold). This means I got a return of 600 gold per gem spent. Had I lost again and needed to spent another 25 gems I still would have got a return of 300 gold per gem spent (higher than my assumption that each gem is worth 275). But again this is my personal benchmark that makes me spend my gems, others would have their own.
In my gems calculation, I am talking from a free to play perspective. The thing is I have never bought gems and the only thing I buy is the royale pass each month for my main account. I have a second account that I haven't bought anything for. As such due to the limited free gems I get, I use them vary wisely (hence my 275 gold per gem rule). Some have posted that I should use a calculation on how much return we get for a classic or grand challenge. To spend gems on these first of all doesn't guarantee what you get in return (unless you a pro who can get 12 wins every time). Secondly if I were to spend gems on these, and then also need to spend gems to complete challenges too, I would have to buy gems at some point. In this case by buying gems, it becomes a calculation of how much money is spent converts to how much gold I get for that money.
2) How did you assume that in the old clan wars that you always got on average 2,000 gold per day? In your example unless you are a CRL pro you aren't going to win your final war day every time, so you have skewed the figures here.
Answer: Don't forget the old CW1 system would occasionally give the war day prize as anywhere between 10-50 Gems. I can remember a few times getting the full 50 Gems (worth 13,750 gold in my calculations). From my calculations even 10 Gems = 2,750 gold on its own. So even if you were given 10 or 20 Gems every now and then makes the average daily gold won from CW1 go up. Getting those gems as a prize was independent of how well you did that particular clan war too. So this would offset occasions where you lost the final battle or did bad on card collection too. This is why I believe 2000 gold won daily from clan wars 1 battles was a fair estimate at least for me. Overall this average of 2000 gold is a bit subjective and each person can conclude that it was slightly higher or lower for them.
3) How do I then say clan wars 2 gives on average only 2000 gold daily gold for attacks especially given in my example above I assumed I won the final war day in old clan wars? Shouldn't I just assume I'd win all 4 1v1 battles too?
Answer: Firstly in my example of the old clan wars I put down that I won half the battles. In that example I put down winning 1 card collection battle, losing 2 of them and then winning the final war day. This amounts to 1500 gold in itself. You would also get the same gold from winning 3 card collection battles and losing the final war day attack too. Also as explained in point 2, when you factor in that you could also win gems in clan war 1 this makes the average gold won per day go up.
In regards to Clan Wars 2. So far my results from the 4 days of clan warring is as follows. On my main account all did was 1v1s. Every battle has been against people with a minimum pb of 6000 trophies and in most cases above 6500 (my pb is around 6000). I have won roughly 50% of these matches, definitely no easy matches at all at least for me. Best result was 3 wins one day, worst result was just 1 win (average 2000 gold).
I have another account too that is almost as strong as my main and two days in a row I tried duels. Day 1 I lost all 4 1v1 matches. On day 3 and 4 I tried to do duels. One duel I lost 2-1 and the other I won 2-1. So for the duels I won 3850 gold over two days for those 2 duels with one attack with my worst deck remaining to try and win in 1v1. You could adjust these daily average figures slightly either way to say the average should be a bit higher than 2000 gold for the new system. Also you can again take the safe approach of just attacking players boats for a guaranteed 2000 daily gold. So either way I feel the 2000 gold per day average for the new clan wars is a fair figure.
Also some have commented that for their circumstances it is even worse than old clan wars since they have lower accounts that don't have 32 maxed card. So their match ups now make it nearly impossible to win more than one 1v1 game per day. So they would probably just be forced to do the boat battles to get that guaranteed 2000 daily gold.
4) You have failed to include the free tokens you get from tournaments in your calculations.
ANSWER: In terms of what tokens themselves are worth when converting them into gold, you don't get much for them. They say they are giving us more of them, but by giving us more of them, we get less of something else.
As such regarding Tokens given to us in the free global tournament prize pool, to be honest I think this worsens the gold we used to get.
As explained above if you purely convert Tokens into what they are worth for Gold
Legendary Token = 2000 gold
Epic Token = 1000 gold
Rare Token = 500 gold
Common token = 250 gold.
These are the amounts of gold you get for these tokens if you max them out and then collect another. In the global tournament they now boringly always give 2 sets of these you that need to win at least 8 matches in the tournament to get them all. So for 8 matches you win a free 7500 gold. I'd rather more random prizes like they used to give for free in the global tournament such as chests that were easily worth more than a single trade token (or in this case 8 trade tokens worth 7500 gold).
5) You assumed you won all clan war 1 final attacks, yet assume you will only win 50% of your new clan war 2 attacks.
Answer : My example of clan wars 1 stated winning 1 card collection battle then winning the final war day. That also means losing 2 card collection battles. This is actually a 50% win rate (that is 2 wins from 4 battles).
Also in my case I invested spending gold to make cards war day ready ie making them level 12 (at the expense of perhaps delaying maxing out decks for ladder).
This actually skewed results to tailor me winning more final war days. I viewed spending gold in this way as an investment that if I won war days, I would get gold returned.
As such I finished off clan wars 1 winning 300 war days at 70% win rate. I'm not a good player by any means, but my gold investments meant I got a better than 2 out of 3 win rate for final war day matches.
The other thing not included in the calculations is that occasionally you also use to get a second war attack too. From data I have gained from my clan website I have worked out that I got the second clan attack 5.6% of the time.
External link →