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First - I know anyone reading this is ultra die hard LE fans. So warning I’m about to be critical of some things from the recent DevTalk and if that triggers you…stop reading here.
So, from the recent DevTalk some routine topics are brought up as always. And, over the years I’ve been critical of LEs approach to the genre with understanding that sometimes it works out, but sometimes it doesn’t.
One of those faults is this seemingly weird contempt to follow a conventional norm of this Genre. Almost to the degree that it feels like there’s a systemic hate for ARPGs inside EHG. And, I’ve said it before it’s okay that not every single facet of Last Epoch has to be different, or go against conventional ARPG mechanics just for the sake of saying “look we’re the different one”.
The first that comes to mind is the Mono topic of a boring end game, and what has surprised me for years is that for an ARPG like Last Epoch that it’s biggest highlight in every review is it’s item crafting system, that Monos can’t be crafted at all. BUT, since PoE did “craftable” maps best, now it’s off the table…or has been ignored for years. All Monos ever needed was a crafting system like the itemization system where player agency had more control over the type of echo they were running. Being able to control density, modifiers, in echo events, double bosses, triple bosses, % Chance to spawn a Harbinger…just random sh*t that the player could craft into the echo. “But that’s just PoE” GOOD…we don’t need to reinvent the wheel every single system and mechanic. Use the already implemented shard system, inventory, and make some new shards that can be crafted into an Echo device. It really doesn’t need to be so complex and complicated, this could have been done 2 years ago.
Second, on the DevTalk there was talk about combining legendary items to ramp LP to eventually target loot or obtain a god tier chase item. So two 0LP items make a 1LP, four 1LP items make a 2LP, eight 2LP items make a 3LP, and sixteen 3LP items make a single 4LP item. And that sounds AWESOME. Because, it gives you a reason to keep grinding and going, knowing there is a light at the end of the tunnel for SSF players. So, what was Mikes take on this?
“Eventually, you get the item. You kill enough boars in the woods and you just get the item. I don’t feel a sense of excitement from a system like that, I feel relieved.”
- Firstly, this is such a cop out downplay of what this type of system could be designed as, saying just kill a couple boars. You can easily make the system require higher tier Base Legendaries to bypass the issue of it seeming trivial. You can make a Primary combiner slot and feeder slots, the primary spots Base Level will remain and gain LP from the feeder items.
EXAMPLE: If I have a 0LP level 5 legendary, and a 0LP level 85 base Legendary, I put the level 85 in the primary spot and the level 5 in the feeder slot and the level 85 gains 1LP. NOW, to get 2LP I can say that the “feeder” items need a minimum base of 65+, and then for 3LP that the feeder bases need to be level 80+ to make the single 4LP item.
This means that by the time you achieve a single 4LP item that you are well into the end game. And it doesn’t even impact trade merchant guild because the cost of level 85+ 3LP items will still be insane, if anything this actually makes them more valuable making it rare to obtain 4LP items.
Otherwise, all you get by the time anyone gets to level 95 is just stash tabs on stash tabs of useless junk legendary items. There’s no excitement about these items, and they have literally, LITERALLY 0 value in the game currently. So why dismiss an idea that actually makes junk Legendaries valuable?
- Secondly, and most importantly, is the second take that this system is not exciting, it’s relieving. This comment to me highlights the systemic issues I see inside EHG when looking and understanding their position in the ARPG market. They are between the hyper casual Diablo IV and the hyper hardcore PoE / PoE2. And yet, they fundamentally don’t understand their player engagement qualities. The sheer minimal number of Last Epoch players who would even play a single season long enough to even see a single 3LP item let alone a 4LP item is so minimal it may be more rare than seeing a 4LP Red Ring.
This is where I am concerned for the future of Last Epoch if they don’t start listening and understanding what players in the ARPG space find FUN. Fun, being the absolute most primary thing you should be trying to achieve.
- The true reality is simply this - most Legendarys have a “nearly absolute impossible” chance to drop 4LP. Some with crazy 1 in quintillion calculations. So the chance anyone, ever, gets any “excitement” from a 4LP drop is nearly 0. And even if one did drop it’s not even potentially “exciting” in most cases it’s going to be the opposite. It’s going to be a 4LP Falcon Chestpiece at level 95, and the season is going to wipe before they ever find the time to use it or craft it…so instead its “cool, I guess” then it’s just stash trash that gets deleted.
So, Mike, there isn’t even Excitement happening with 4LP item ANYWAY. Giving someone the path to be relieved, or be excited is better than not having one at all. HELL, I HAVE SEEN MORE PEOPLE EXCITED ABOUT FINALLY GETTING A HEADHUNTER THROUGH DIVINATION CARDS than I have seen them be relieved. Why, because the net result of that trade off is that player, that person is having more fun. They still had to work to achieve that item, they had to get the materials, they had to grind the gold if it as trade, they had to combine and take risks to achieve the final result. And the final result is a dopamine hit and a power spike in their build after 100 hours of commitment to your game. And hell most of them probably immediately bought a cool cosmetic to make it even cooler giving the dev team much needed funding.
So here’s my feedback.
STOP, please stop, hating the wheels of this genre. You don’t have to be f*cking different on every single f*cking minute detail in every mechanic in the game just to be different. Please, just do the things that players will get a net result of “fun” back in return when they put 100 hours into a season.
I played season 1, by week 3, because of the duping and issues the trade merchant guild was dead, there was literally no one playing the game after 18 days. That mass exodus from the season meant that 95% of the players you are concerned about not finding enjoyment in a 1 in quintillion Chance drop never even made it to Normal Lagon.
EHG needs a systemic internal shift. And god, I want to see it happen because I have over 600 hours in this game, but every DevTalk is just a depressing hate fest on what makes the ARPG genre great because of some internal contrived hate for what’s worked for decades.
Just make the game FUN.
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