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RIOT GAMES: Makes a huge narrative about who wins may be the GOAT of NA.
PHREAK, starting game 5: But TSM has the Greatest player of All time in NA in Bjergsen.
?????
RIOT GAMES: Makes a huge narrative about who wins may be the GOAT of NA.
PHREAK, starting game 5: But TSM has the Greatest player of All time in NA in Bjergsen.
?????
Put it this way: If Bjergsen won, he's the GOAT, no question. If Double won, it's still a debate. That's the prevailing sentiment, that's my opinion, that's what I said. I stand by that 100%.
Ok you can have your opinion but do you think it’s appropriate to state it as if it were a fact when casting for hundreds of thousands of viewers?
Yes.
I've heard this said several times now and I honestly don't know why it's still such a strong debate even when Doublelift now has objectively more NA championship wins than Bjergson. He was able to get to this point even after taking an entire split off because TSM did not make the finals for two entire splits, at one point losing in playoffs to Clutch Gaming and not even coming in fourth place.
I watched your segment on the Dive when one of your main points for Doublelift ranking below Bjergson was because of the losses he suffered while on CLG, going to relegations, etc., whereas in your opinion Bjergson has always been consistently on top.
But why then, are these past lower team standings for TSM, which happened far more recently, and thus should be even more relevant, seemingly overlooked? Even in the first half of this split, TSM did not look particularly strong, but now that they have one impressively strong win streak in the past three splits (which TL have won all of), Bjergson is immediately still the objectively clear-cut GOAT, without question?
From my perspective, by the way you argue and make your points, Bjergson's reputation and standing is completely unshakable regardless of his previous low points. But in direct contrast to that, Doublelift's past failings are apparently like bullet wounds that just keep bleeding out and never truly heal.
Your opinion either comes from heavy bias in favor of Bjergson, or heavy bias against Doublelift, and most people seem inclined to believe it's the latter.
I fundamentally disagree with the notion that because it happened recently, it matters in an all time debate. We're not saying who's better on April 19, 2019. We're saying who's the best player of all time. It's like saying that Michael Jordan isn't as good as LeBron James because when's the last time MJ even picked up a basketball?
So, that out of the way, let's talk about more of the details:
Bjergsen's low points are getting 3rd place once and 5/6th place once. Otherwise, across eleven splits he's not only made playoffs every single time, but he's made nine finals and won five of those. He also has four MVP honors. Let me put that in a different perspective: Bjergsen won an MVP title every single year until 2018, when Doublelift finally won his first.
Doublelift's recent accolades are indeed impressive. He's won six LCS titles now. He's absolutely the best domestic Bot Laner in LCS history. That's for sure true. But his low points? His entire first two and a half years: 5/6th, 5th, 3rd, 6th, 5/6th. Mind you this is in a league with only eight teams so missing playoffs is laughable. By the time Doublelift won an LCS semifinal, Bjergsen already had two championships. And when he finally won with CLG? Stixxay fills in his shoes the next split and they win without him. And then not only get out of groups internationally, but make MSI finals.
Then Doublelift wins with TSM. And the very next split they go on to win without him.
See, Doublelift's successes have all been when he's playing with other greats or when joining on with superteams. His titles have all come alongside either Xmithie, the all-time best NA jungler (domestic and international) or Bjergsen (same, but Mid Lane). Doublelift has not been the cornerstone player of a successful team. Two of his former teams already showed they can do it without him.
That's why I don't think Doublelift is the best LCS player of all time.
And to be clear, this debate is one of domestic success. If we're debating international, Doublelift is no longer the best NA Bot Laner, as that goes to Sneaky or it goes to WildTurtle for actually getting out of groups at Worlds and winning IEM with TSM.
Hmmm, I understand your frustration at some of the responses from the community, but it's really strange that you can't acknowledge for a second how it might've been inappropriate on your part to state an opinion as fact. Nonetheless, no hate for you man. I think you're a great caster, and certainly don't deserve the vile comments you've been getting. I'm just a bit confused at your response / attitude towards this... that's all.
Here's the thing about casting though: It's a performance. It's by definition subjective. There's no peer-reviewed studies and scientific experiments. You're up there providing your point of view. X champion is stronger in the matchup. This team comp is better in the late game. That TP sucked. That's the position. That's what we do.
People have told me I have fake hype. I don't. I have my hype for the game in front of me. That example applies broadly.
Faker is the greatest LoL player of all time. Doublelift is the best domestic Bot Laner in NA history but had a history of choking internationally until last year. Caps is the best Mid Laner to ever come out of Europe. Those statements are all subjective, but guess what? I'm saying all of them at MSI. That's the job. So indeed I do stand by what I said. Honestly, I could have been less glib about it, I regret how I approached these discussions, and I'll do better next time. But that's my job.