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Hello all! Long-time reader of this subreddit since the Burning Tides Expansion and Diamond-Masters LOR player. While I usually don't post here, this feels like a good time to tackle this topic. As many of us have experienced, this has been (subjectively speaking) the worst feeling expansion for a variety of reasons. (Notice I said worst feeling, not worst quality, that's up for debate). However, instead of venting in a post, I decided to tackle this using the Dan Folder Feedback format in the hopes that it may lead to meaningful discussion on the topic.

Here is the original article for more information on this feedback format. https://playruneterra.com/en-us/news/dev/giving-feedback-like-a-game-dev/

I'm also taking inspiration from another post, that detailed issues with Ryze as a template for this post. https://www.reddit.com/r/LegendsOfRuneterra/comments/11aufln/the_ryze_problem_a_post_in_the_felder_feedback/

If you haven't read it, the main thesis is that players are good at identifying issues, but awful at giving solutions to those issues. Similar to how you might go to the doctor and be able to tell them what's wrong/your symptoms, but they're there to prescribe the treatment.

I will break this post into 2 Parts: The first part will detail issues and bright spots with Rotation, and the second part will detail issues, and bright spots, with the Glory In Navori Expansion itself.

Part 1: Rotation

After giving Rotation a chance for the first 72 hours, it honestly feels bad. But not objectively bad, as there are honestly good things that came out of it. There are many cards in the game that would simply become too powerful as new cards were added to the game and their design created constant balance issues and limited design space. Ezreal, Twisted Fate, and Lee Sin being popular examples. Rotating these cards will allow the devs to balance them without the added pressure of accounting for the next cards in an expansion.

There were also many cards that were just too evergreen and would limit deck building because they were auto include cards because of how much they benefit their archetypes: Eye of the dragon, vile feast, Legion Rearguard, being popular examples of this. These cards getting rotated allow for more interesting deck builds instead of relying on the same reliable tools and forcing the devs to power creep just to play different cards.

There are also other cards that simply never found a spot in the game or whose designs were simply not exciting/or too binary to ever be buffed without resulting in a bad player experience. Vlad, Tahm Kench, Soraka, come to mind here.

So the bright spot here is that rotation, did in fact, open up a whole new meta that forced players to try new decks. (Unfortunately, content creators and net decks are already solving the meta and it hasn't even been a full week.)

But even with those bright spots, Rotation FEELS really bad, and imo, that's mainly due to 2 things:

  1. Non-problematic cards like Zilean, Viktor, Trundle and Rumble getting rotated while much more problematic cards like Akshan, Nami, Karma, Fizz, etc. were allowed to stay. (Akshan can literally lock his opponent into an infinite loop if a player chose to do so???! How is this still allowed?)
  2. Perhaps, more importantly, a clear lack of meaningful communication behind the reasoning certain cards were rotated while others were allowed to stay.

There is already a precedent set for communication as every patch note and LOR update is followed by some form of meaningful explanation.

But Rotation is one of the biggest changes to happen to the game. Maybe the biggest! There are now many archetypes in the game that feel half-baked (Reputation, Nightfall, Everything in Frelford lol to name a few) without the extra cards. Certain champs got their champ spell card rotated while others were allowed to stay. I'm sure there is good reasoning for these changes somewhere, but the fact is, we as a community, haven't got one yet. On top of that, we didn't find out the rotation changes until literally the day before the expansion dropped. There were definitely cards that needed to be rotated for various reasons, but it feels like it went way too far in the end.

I'm aware we're getting an explanation later, but it really feels like the devs decided to take a "wait and see" approach to feedback by dropping Rotation on us first then giving feedback after our reaction. However, that's only a personal theory on my part.

It's literally like watching Avengers: Infinity War for the first time and watching the Thanos Snap happen. It feels sudden, unexpected, and it left a bad feeling for everyone involved.

Solutions: I'm assuming that we will get new cards to feel out these archetypes and enforce region identities, but that's a 2-3 month wait between card drops. Some cards could be rotated back in/out earlier than expected to balance out certain archetypes.

Part 2: The Glory In Navori Expansion

Honestly, the best way I can describe how I feel about this expansion is one word: Anti-climatic.

Rotation already did a lot of damage going into this, but looking on the bright side, I was excited for the new cards. Jack is an incredibly successful example of a non-league champion enhancing the lore while bringing something new to the game while Sett and Samira are both full of flavor while staying true to their League counterparts. Spoiler season is great as always and its one of my parts of being LOR player and this subreddit!

But, with that being said, they have brought more of the same problems along. Samira's new cards are already getting abused by Fizz, Nami, Shelly, and co. while Karma is straight up abusing the coin mechanic. And Rotation was supposed to create a whole new meta filled with experimentation, but to be honest, net decking is already solving everything as usual.

It's things like this that make it hard to see the justification for Rotation. Yes, Rotation got rid of many problematic cards but we lost many others that were really fun and balanced cards while introducing new cards that immediately caused the same old problems!

Ionia abuse, elusives being near impossible to engage, more burst spells to abuse (All Out is insane! and it's in Noxus of all places!)

Solutions: Make coins and Samira's spell cards focus speed instead of burst to limit abuse in certain archetypes and create more counterplay. Make All-Out 2 cost or focus speed or both. Nerf Karma to 6 mana to hone in her identity as a late game bomb, adjust stats to compensate.

The final issue is the lackluster Battle Pass and content overall. There's less content in this Battle Pass compared to pass expansions and even the followers and champs have less-to-no voiceovers this time around. It's like Inflation economics made its way into Legends Of Runeterra and we're seeing the effects for the first time.

PS: Thank you to the devs for your hard work and dedication to this game! Despite everything, you have built an incredible card game and we're all thankful for your dedication to this game!

Edit: Added actionable solutions to each area to add more feedback.

Anyway, this is my rant, thanks for reading this far if you did. Lemme know what you guys think of Rotations, the Glory Of Navori Expansion, my opinions on what makes this so frustrating, and the suggested solutions.

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about 2 months ago - /u/Dan_Felder - Direct link

Thanks for writing this up. I'm going to give it a closer read when I get back from my walk.

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