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You still get Jett's that go 4-17. You still get entire teams that never use voice chat. Still get running one-tapped across the map. Still seeing the same strategies that I saw in silver. I don't feel like my aim is getting any better, nor is my game sense. The only difference is that it takes me 5x longer to find a match now. It only ever took 30 seconds or less to find a match in silver and gold, now it takes over 3-4 minutes to find a match in plat. This rank system feels so arbitrary, that the only difference between silver and plat just happens to be how good your win percentage is, which doesn't factor in skill or game sense at all, it's just luck that's based on whether you have smurfs on your team or not.

Coming from CS:GO, there's such a noticeable difference between silver, gold nova, and master guardian, that you can almost tell even without seeing their rank. Hopefully they rework the rank system soon, because it really doesn't work in its current state.

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about 3 years ago - /u/EvrMoar - Direct link

Originally posted by Supanova00

They are the same man. Because of alt accounts... There are tonnes of people in S/G that are Dia/Immortal. I've been in S/G all act. I'm ok with it and not complaining about my own rank because G is probably my skill level at the moment. I feel pretty well matched in G, but I feel like I'm too powerful for S.

But the key here is being against TRUE S or G. I play sooooo many games where people on each team are just ridiculously good. These guys are 100% NOT true S or G. They are Dia or higher and on an alt account. The rare case of a guy that's popping off. But it's so easy to tell because these guys flick and hit heads over and over whereas the other people in the match are feet shooters. So usually the guy that goes 30.10 is going to make that team win. Some games I play have 3 people who are Dia who are stacked 5 with their 2 useless buddies and boosting them. They say it on Voice and Chat, lower ranks are infested with people that shouldnt be there... same as higher ranks are infested with their boosted friends that shouldnt be there....

I played a game yesterday where these two clowns on my team kept taunting the other team and saying they have NO chance of winning just FF. They said it from the start, and yeah we walked all over them. This Brimstone popped off, and this Reyna who was his friend was trash, but the idiot kept on trash talking me, because I popped off too for 19.5 with KJ, and this Reyna is like there is no way you are S2, how can you be above me look how bad your Cross hair placement is etc, just talking shit to me the entire time even when I aced. I'm like wtf. So the Brim clearly there boosting his Reyna buddy, and the Reyna was pissed because he wasn't number 2 on the K/D.

So that Reyna will end up in Plat or Dia if the Brim gets him up there, and probably go 4.20...

Up until immortal the system uses both performance, and wins, to determine your MMR.

If you are not performing effectively, against higher MMR opponents, it becomes very hard to get boosted. The system looks at every interaction with enemies in every match, and the MMR of all the players involved with those interactions. You have to win duels, use abilities, and win against players above your MMR to climb. If you are constantly losing duels, or not setting up assists/site takes with your abilities, you will not increase your performance MMR and will struggle to get past Plat.

There are pretty decent skill differences between each rank, because we look at every fight every player takes in every game, the system is actually really good at determining if you are better then any given player in the match you are in because of this!

The ranked system isn't magic math just pushing you upwards, it's a ladder. These systems work because you have to perform better, and win against, higher skilled opponents bringing yourself up the ladder.

You can learn a little bit from this article we posted here!

https://playvalorant.com/en-us/news/dev/ask-valorant-rank-rating-edition/

about 3 years ago - /u/EvrMoar - Direct link

Originally posted by IceFire_HB

I think they should reset the mmr each episode. The players that got better will have it easier to climb higher and the boosted players will sit in low elo again. I'm a silver player, starting with the game in act 2 ep. 1 and i think i have pretty decent aim and game sence (dominating dm), but my games are absolute trash, sometimes I have people who carry me through the match, othertimes my teammates are absolute trash. They play like Iron 1 and I don't hate on people. I seriously don't know what I can do, to get better, other than getting better aim, because u either get 1taped every round or dominate everyone. Did anybody had the same experience? Sry for the long text :)

I see this alot, but unfortunately MMR resets won't do anything besides cause chaos until everything ends up exactly where it is now.

MMR isn't some magical math holding you back, it's a ladder. If you beat players above you, you climb up the ladder stealing some MMR from them. Reseting MMR won't make the players above you any easier to kill, it will just squish everyone and make it so the first few months are "hope I got the guy who was immortal+ on my team this match". It would be radiants, immortals, bronze, irons, etc. all on the same team, and the good players would just stomp their way to the top, waiting for the lower ranks to fill out.

We also do soft MMR resets each episode, so if you really believe you are hardstuck next Episode would be the perfect time to prove that. But like other posts I've written, the system looks at not only winning but performance(diamond and under). It looks at every interaction with enemies you have, every assist you help get, and the MMR of all players involved. If you are truly better then people in your lobby, but lose the match, you can increase your performance MMR(but decrease your win MMR) and still open yourself up to climb. This is also why pros fly through low ranks fast, and even tho smurfs are a hot topic, why it's hard to maintain a smurf in low ranks unless you are purposefully throwing to do so.

Hope that explains a little bit why we won't probably ever reset MMR. Right now the conversation is how do we reduce the reasons players want to smurf, how to identify smurfs, and how do we handle smurfs when we identify them. That being said, even if the entire playerbase over plat smurfed, they wouldn't even be able to fill every single match in gold that occurs. So while smurfing is currently a topic the ranked team is focused on, our intial investigations make us think it may be slightly blown up in how often it's occurring. It's always hard to determine if a player that's popping off is actually a smurf, or just having a good game.

about 3 years ago - /u/EvrMoar - Direct link

Originally posted by fortnitebabys69

You need to also factor in the amount of games played.....

? I guess I don't understand what you mean by this, if you are targeting my talk on MMR soft reset or smurfing.

Obviously amount of games played is important for MMR, I don't think I need to cover that.

In terms of smurfing, if a player is winning and stomping lots of lower games then they would increase their rank and their smurf account would no longer be smurfing but at the rank it belongs at. Radiants can often get up to Radiant MMR in around 20 games from a brand new account.

But yes when talking about these issues internally we are very aware of the amount of matches played and how it factors into all of this.

about 3 years ago - /u/EvrMoar - Direct link

Originally posted by IceFire_HB

Thanks for answering to this problem! It's my first post and I'm happy to see, that a riot employee instantly responded. I didn't see the point you made before, so thank you.

No problem!

It's extremely difficult, because there are two types of conflicts when thinking about ranked. You have the want to increase your skill, find your exact skill, and be a better player. Then you also have the want to express your skill and the prestige of high ranks. So the prestige of the high rank can cause pressure, or even overtake, the goal of finding your true skill. Also players value these things differently.

Luckily our comments are pretty typical, most ranked systems see negative feedback with smurfs, match making quality, MMR representation, grouping with friends, etc. So we are on the right track and just need to try and figure out how to improve or reduce friction for these pain points.

about 3 years ago - /u/EvrMoar - Direct link

Originally posted by fortnitebabys69

Radiants can often get up to Radiant MMR in around 20 games..

Math just doesn't check out. You start at maximum plat 3 with a win being let's be generous at 25. 4 games diamond 1, 8 games d2, 12, d3, 16 immortal assuming you don't loose any. And your telling me In 4 games they will be Radiant.... playing against what should be the best players in your game.... doesn’t happen . What needs to be done for the majority of players id say plat 3 and below is it should be based upon games played if you have played 100 games in silver you should face people that have 100 games in silver. Insta qs are great but I'd rather wait 2-4 minutes for a competitive match. You need a system that rewards players for dominating the game so they are can be separated from those who aren't...

Edit : or the other side is that you are giving people higher mmr than visual ranks so that if your playing very competitive silver players they could infact have radiant mmr....😶

https://twitter.com/TenZOfficial/status/1348551918763663360

We haven't changed the MMR system, just how we message your rank. So here is an example of someone getting to "Radiant MMR" in 16 matches(because we haven't change the MMR system, you can still get your MMR there).

I have lots of write-ups on this reddit account that explains why we have MMR separate from Ranked. The highest you can place a new account is Plat 3, so there is a world where you could be Plat in Radiant MMR. For brief reasons why we do this is that it stops cheaters, and we need you to play multiple matches to prove your rank at least a little bit(so a lucky win streak doesn't put you at a higher rank then you belong). This also makes it harder to boost, or create new accounts and get them to a high rank with the goal of selling them.

Hope that helps!

about 3 years ago - /u/EvrMoar - Direct link

Originally posted by Marethyuuu

So if I geht the system right, it is easier to climb when picking a fragger(dia and below( have played some immortal games and thought it was way more chill when i supported my fraggers))? Cause with that you have better chances to deal dmg and get assists? Or does a smoke or anything count into doing an assist?

All abilities, and everyone involved in kills, are taken into account!

about 3 years ago - /u/EvrMoar - Direct link

Originally posted by bluefroggy77

what is a soft MMR reset?

It looks different depending on the game or ranked system. Usually it's some sort of "squish" where it kind of grabs all the ranks like a sandwhich and squishes them together - everyone is essentially brought towards some center point(usually around silver).

In our game we have a confidence system, which has an idea how you might perform if you are having a good, bad, or average match. So when you are match made, it tries to keep you in that range of where it thinks you are performing at. This is just match making, and does not effect how much MMR you will gain from that match. If you start wining a bunch, or losing a bunch, and the system starts to think you may have had a big change in your skill it widens that confidence area and lets you match further up or down. This is to make sure you never get hardstuck if you truly are winning more then you are losing.

We loosen the confidence on all players, essentially resetting it. So again, if you were truly hardstuck, you are given space to prove that. This is also why we see lots of feedback at the beginning of the episode that match making feels a little crazy, because the match maker is letting all players prove themselves again. If a simple change of letting the match maker let you match make a little further outside your confidence gives us that much feedback at start of season, you can bet match making on a full reset would be pure chaos.

It's always an interesting topic, but so far we've been happy with Episode resets, and the new act starts(no resets).