Original Post — Direct link

*Everything below is solely based on the AoC Tank Preview. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwWK9HJNJRQ .


From what I've observed in the Tank preview, the threat generated from heals is roughly the same as threat generated from damage. As in 1 damage to a mob generates 1 threat; Likewise 1 friendly heal generates 1 threat on a mob. Why does this matter? Not all damage etc from tank is going to hit every mob, meanwhile every point of healing done, not considering over-healing, via the healer is going to build up AOE threat on every mob in combat.

This is nothing new, although usually threat from heals is a fraction of healing done, however it is important because tanks with heals, such as Paladin, which has "mostly self heals", will potentially be able to outperform managing aggro from more mobs (sounds familiar). A quick example of this is on initially pulling mobs, a Paladin starting at half health could pull and then quickly selfheal to instantly have that heal amount of threat per mob. (This would work similar to 'Bloodrage', without the threat multiplier in WoW - for all you prot warrs...)

From my estimates a Cleric can generate threat at:

30 per sec * Number of players (Cleansing Wave)

7.5 per sec * Number of Players (Communal restoration)

and (Chains of Restraint) is... 40-50 ish ....


While a Tank can generate threat at:

15-16 per sec as Threat from damage either from skills or basic attacks...

However, the tank ability 'Inciting Strikes' has been observed to steal aggro from Cleric after becoming way behind in threat presumably to it's "additional threat" modifier. (Only skill for tank that indicates this)

!! ... While healing in the tank preview appeared to be lock to a preset amount ie 50/100/150/200, rather than being based on stats/gear, it is still relevant for showing threat amounts generated. These numbers seemed to be a rough guess + bonus for showcasing the gameplay smoothly, however values in the live game could prove much higher... meaning more effort from tank is needed... !!

Lack of Threat/DPS Meters:

It appears that Steven Sharif has stated that no threat/dps meters will be in the game, along with any other addons. Reason provided is that (1) it can creates toxicity; (2) threat meter is replaced with visual/audible effects of mobs/something.

This is not to hate (cause idk if I even do), only to note... while watching the tank preview, there was no notable indications of mobs losing aggro. Not to mention that the issue with a signal from the mob that it is soon to change threat via animation/etc - if this is the way they implement this - seems like a potential for exploitation if that animation causes the enemy to pause attacking etc, but it was painfully obvious that any sudden indication of losing aggro will be a rough to track.

During a fight with just 3 mobs and 3 party members, animations are flying and literally on occasion blinding the player from even seeing the enemy that could be at that moment gesturing he's losing aggro. Most threat changes witnessed were instant, meaning that a burst of damage, or in a lot of cases big heals, instantly peeled a mob off the tank. This again is nothing new, but it means (1) looking for indicators is a fool's errand; (2) Proper knowledge of tanks skill rotation and damage is needed to be known. eg Shield Assault + Tremoring Bellow + 2xMelee = 110 + 165 + 25 + 27 = 327 threat...

Pre-knowledge is going to be interesting, however it should be noted that the lack of a threat/dps meter =/= less toxicity, instead it focuses it. 1 Tank, 1 Cleric, and 3 DPS.. and with unknown values of dps all faults will be placed on Tank and Cleric, in your average group. If tank can't hold aggro, it's obvious; If Cleric doesn't heal tank, it's obvious. Basically, 3/5 party members is never to blame, seemingly... just saying.

Tank Skills:

- 'Aegis', originally seemed amazing, but there are inherent issues with this type of skill. Having the cleanse tied to big defensive skill on a 20s cd, seems problematic, however the main issue is the protective zone behind the tank. This seems incredible, but the only time to really use it is to defend the team from inescapable damage, which is either going to come as huge boss attack that half-healths the whole team, which means the tank will die if used; or if there is cleave damage... which means that teammates should just move away/around.

The way 'Aegis' was used in the tank preview is likely going to be the initial reaction to how the skill needs to be used: The cleric/teammate has aggro, tank pops 'Aegis' to transfer 50% of teammate damage taken to self..., but.... the teammate needs to be behind the tank to transfer damage and if the teammate is behind, so is the mob that the tank needs to regain aggro from. We're looking at a merry-go-round ability: Cleric runs behind tank, mob chases Cleric, tank faces mob requiring cleric to run behind tank...

This is probably the most common situation that's going to occur, while adapting to this skill, as shown in the preview, Steven actually learns to keeps to the shield/ his back towards his teammate and without turning, back-pedals to position himself between the mob and his teammate (luckily this mob had range so there was distance between the two), but this makes for clearly awkward gameplay.

External link →
over 1 year ago - /u/IntrepidStudios - Direct link

Hey all,

Like a few other people say in this thread, we haven’t done a balance pass on things like aggro generation values and Tank abilities. The Development Update Livestreams are intended to show our progress and the direction things like the Tank archetype are taking. As we say in almost every livestream, what we’re sharing is a work-in-progress, and not the final product.

You’re right that we don’t plan to have DPS or threat meters in game, and that instead there will be animation and ability indicators to show that Tanks may be losing aggro. While we haven’t shown this yet during a livestream, we spoke about this during the February 2023 Development Update. For people that missed this, here’s a timestamp to that conversation, if you want to listen to our vision for how this should work.

We do appreciate you making the time to share your thoughts on the direction the Tank archetype is taking, but don’t worry too much about the specific threat values and numbers on the Tank abilities seen on recent livestreams. Alpha Two will be our time to get feedback on these things, and we hope you’ll be able to join us for that testing phase!