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I have been talking for a while with others and came to one simple conclusion, the game does not need boats or trains in its current state. Not saying it would be cool to have them. Just that the current need for them is not there because of the cheaper means of moving products.

Currently, you can carry a stack of 20 rocks, wood, steel, and several other carry only items. This means you can carry 5 m^3 of any carry only objects. Transitioning from carrying rocks in hand to a cart, your would increase this several times over. By the time you get to the truck, you can carry just about 520 rocks, or 130 m^3 worth of space. A truck that takes up roughly 12 m^3 of space having the ability to carry 130 m^3 of space is a bit much.

I propose that the default stack limit for carrying only items be reduced to 4 (from 20) to make it a bit more realistic, and then continue that forward, with the truck being able to carry somewhere in the ballpark of 200ish ( If we go with 260, that would mean the truck would have 65 m^3 space of carrying capacity.) . If this were to happen, then the need for boats and trains would increase with larger carrying capacity. Yes, it would suck if the default was changed from 20 to 4, but this would also extend the Eco experience, force more cooperation between others, and better simulate a society expanding through the ages.

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3 days ago - /u/SLG-Dennis - Direct link

Originally posted by Birphon

So, one thing that seems pretty evident is that everyone lives super close together* so that "time isn't wasted" mentality which kinda puts the likes of Trucks and other Inventory based vehicles a secondary inventory and not a "this will help me travel to other people".

Boats and Trains can aid this as you most likely wont have a boat/train to go like 20 blocks will you. Boats and Trains will enable longer distance traveling which enables more spread out communities or different clusters which also enables larger world sizes to be used.

\At least on the server I play on we basically always live on some form of island together (cause thats what gens on a Small Map) and every rarely spread apart - mainly because we only have a small handful of people playing - like we are enough apart where we can have a decent claim size but thats about it*

On public servers people spread a lot, often way more than they should. It's in opposite much more a problem that people tend to live so much away from each other that it becomes problematic. (But we're actually incentivizing that local community spread with the biome restrictions, as we want them to use trucks to drive to others - I just see people spreading that wouldn't need to as well)

3 days ago - /u/SLG-Dennis - Direct link

Originally posted by Birphon

so then more validation for boats/trains to cover the longer distances.

I feel like everything before the first gas powered truck is "local" use only. The first gas powered truck onwards is dependent on what the situation is like based on your server's Oil Baron/s. If they have a large Network of gas and can supply a lot of it in a large area then maybe the Boats/Trains aren't needed as much.

I'm not sure how boats (I omit trains, as that's not going to happen during EA) can help with that exactly, given it will be unlikely there is water access to everyone and boats will be distinctively slower than trucks - which will also get trailers as an addition for road transport. Trucks can be put on a type of boat, though, the idea is indeed the mass storage, I just personally never understand why people want that, given it seems many people cheat their stacksizes up anyway. I'm not sure those would swap to boats. And if you just up the stacksizes, you certainly don't need them at all.

3 days ago - /u/SLG-Dennis - Direct link

Originally posted by Birphon

so then more validation for boats/trains to cover the longer distances.

I feel like everything before the first gas powered truck is "local" use only. The first gas powered truck onwards is dependent on what the situation is like based on your server's Oil Baron/s. If they have a large Network of gas and can supply a lot of it in a large area then maybe the Boats/Trains aren't needed as much.

Let me extend on that. For all features we add we of course have an idea what they're supposed to do - but given Eco's "Framework Style" the most interesting part is what players will actually ultimately do and come up with on their own.

The hype about boats is massive, so massive the idea behind it seems to be much more limited than the expecations for change via boats actually seem to be to a degree I'm personally not super sure what everyone is ultimately going to do with them that improves their life so much.

A main, very obvious point from us is boats for fishing, that's what we wanted to do. Another is early game get-around quickly with the row-boat instead of swimming or having confusing ways with ramps only. But once infrastructure kicks in, Trucks will be typically more useful aside of when you really want to transport a lot (like multiple trucks with the ferry boat) to specific points reachable by ocean. I just don't see that happen very often or be needed on public servers I visit, no matter if stacksizes are scaled up or not.

For White-Tiger I have kind of an idea how I will use them to fit into its concept, but roads will still be the main thing.