Original Post — Direct link

Whenever I materialize at the Drake Research Station with Bob in tow, the Coalition forces immediately start shooting at "him", even though they are not tagged as hostile (grey target outline). They don't do much damage but it's annoying. I want it to stop.

Speaking of hostile, I noticed there are a number of perks/traits that will inevitably turn neutrals and friendlies against the player. I'm not sure if this is intended behaviour or something the studio may want to look at. I don't relish in killing allies to start with and in the case of infinitely respawning Okkar this may actually cause problems for the player.

As it stands, those abilities and perks can only be used in Rift gameplay because it's the only place we can be sure not to piss off any neutral factions. Using the following abilities elsewhere will also fail any "Repel Attackers" and "Distress Call" quests.

  • Crit happens (pilot perk)
  • Symphony of Destruction (pilot perk)
  • 3/3 Vigilante Set Bonus
  • new attribute "Chance to inflict hit damage in a 200m radius"
  • the area of effect of Flak cannons (aka "splash damage"), especially the Crimson Sun legendary
  • exploding enemies after they've been hit with strong Corrosion/EMP magic

There may be others that I can't think of atm. Basically anything with an area of effect will immediately aggro any neutrals/friendlies close to it and that requires the player to either kill them all or flee, failing any present objectives. It's a lot to deal with imho.

And last but not least, I don't know why the weapons lock-on (R3) seems to prefer locking on to allies instead of hostiles lol. Imho it should just ignore allies completely.

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11 days ago - /u/Giraffasaur_ - Direct link

Originally posted by Hellhound_Rocko

absolutely, i was so sad to discover that you cannot use the Vigilante 3-set because of dev brainfarts - unless you want to automatically fail almost every Distress Call and be unable to defend yourself in allied territory.

and it's even worse: totally inconsistent. for example: you cannot use the Energized Boost perk that webs enemies around you as that'll web all neutrals as well and they'll immediately declare war on you for it - but you can use the Energized Boost perk that deals Energy and Kinetic damage to all foes you fly close by to because that will never apply to greys... which makes it even worse: random to the player if a thing works as it should or not without the item's description telling one about it.

or how about the Vindicator's (and therefore probably also the consumable) Drones not counting as allies surrounding you for Escort Duty set perks/ triggers because that would be silly. but then the opposing Rouge set's 2-set bonus comes along and says nah, one out of merely nine ships shall be incapable of using this set at all despite the drones not being allies, friendlies, neutrals or whatever - but part of the players' freaking ship... ðŸĨīðŸĪŠðŸ˜ðŸ™ƒðŸ§ WTF?? BTW: the Drones themselves also inevitably cause friendly fire from time to time and it makes greys and greens immediately hostile, therefore automatically fail Distress Calls, etc. - because that's totally in the player's hands lol... not. one cannot even stow the darn things.

as if the Vindicator didn't have enough trouble balance wise as is, as on higher difficulties the drones are 99% useless outside the Ult (if you stack enough drone Passives at least, not that you have much of a choice in this regard since the Vindicator's Passives are almost all about the drones instead about something useful). so how about not reducing the ship's shield when they're out? and no, you dont get "bonus" shield when the drones are gone, if you compare the Vindicator to the other two heavies it becomes quite clear that it's the other way around: the shield you should have gets cut in half when the drones are out for no freaking reason at all - all while you already have a secondary gun less (which hinders stacking set boni) than the other 4 consumable slot ships for, again, no reason at all. oof.

To let you in on our mentality, we went back and fourth on the idea of splash damage affecting everything in the area, or only enemies in that area. This raised some controversy internally because we both wanted players to not accidentally aggro neutrals/allies while at the same time feeling like players would recognize a splash damage weapon would hit neutrals/allies; we had to make some decisive actions to what made sense and where.

Certain, intentional splash damage effects only affect enemies (like the EMP device) while others would splash everything (like flak cannons). That said, perks that make everything have splash damage change situations to what you've described would occur; even if the player doesn't want to hit allies, now they almost don't have a choice. Hmmmm. Based on your feedback here, it seems we need to revisit some of this and ensure it is working as intended and feels good. Thanks for sharing your thoughts; here's hoping we can make this feel better.

11 days ago - /u/Giraffasaur_ - Direct link

Originally posted by compulsive_looter

Thanks for explaining the studio's thought process. Appreciated.

Yes I do recognize which weapons cause splash damage and change them on a per-encounter-basis. But I have to say this is not very immersive, having to go to the menu before and after each random encounter or faction job. And sometimes I have to slam on the brakes to do it, because an "Unknown Signal" can hold any kind of surprise.

And pilot perks can't be changed on-the-fly to begin with, as that requires the ship to be docked at a station or the homebase.

Strangely none of this is a problem in "Battle Support" scenarios so evidently the game engine provides for an option that makes allies tolerant to friendly fire.

And please, make the Coalition fighters go easy on Bob - he has done nothing to them! :)


On it!

Originally posted by compulsive_looter

I just wanted to add the "Bird's Nest" legendary mines to the ever growing list of items that has caused a "Repel Attackers" job to fail for me - by angering the two G&B freighters which I had successfully saved from outlaw attackers.

Also earlier today I was fighting an Outlaw Viper and turned it with the "Wrath of the Fallen" legendary cargo unit. It turned green and proceeded to fly straight at me. So far so good. When its 10 seconds were over, it exploded... and doused me in acid, causing significant armor damage.

"Thanks mate, what a great ally you turned out to be!"

We did some testing and the perks Crit Happens and Symphony of Destruction do not hit neutral targets, which is working as intended.

Bird's Nest is an explosive, AoE weapon. If you're launching this into a battle, it very much would damage allies in the area. This is working as intended, much like using any other secondary mine that explodes.

An Outlaw Viper exploding leaving a corrosive area is the natural outcome of the vessel, friend or foe, based on the ship's trait. This is working as intended.

We're still evaluating a couple other instances to make sure we're giving the advantage to the player, but please keep in mind that weapons putting emphasis on splash damage are very much intended to damage everything in the area, friend or foe.

Originally posted by Upstairs-Tank-8098

first of all, totally agree, please don't shoot at Bob (never seem that happen though)

and for symphony of boom / flak / etc, i personally think they're part of the experience: as a professional, you should pick the best-fit-for-the-mission from your arsenal, right? e.g. 9mm to avoid over-penetrate for a hostage situation, 12 gauge for certain pedocillin injection, u don't expect a jack of all rounds magic wand. the same in DMZ, you play Michael Bay in rifts but switch to safer load-out in a group fight. I still care about role playing part of this game ( even in an end-game stage where i'm currently trying rift 600 with interceptor / striker, 400 with vanguard, clearing puzzles no more than one location per gaming session); getting the best performance in rift is not everything

sometimes i jump in a fight between white and red names thinking i'm a good guy, but ended up "wanted" popped up and escaped into superlight, yelling "i'm sorry! i didn't mean it! it's rockfish!". well, part of the game.

IMO, i'd wish for easy load-out switching (equipment + perk) instead of completely disabling friendly splash damage

btw, talking about load-out, may i have unlock and switch-able ship passives too? different play style require different set of passives, but i have only 9 hanger slots. so increasing hanger size also works

Generally speaking this is our mindset as well, but we wanted to give favor to the player for the more controlled parts of the experience versus the randomized ones. Crit Happens and Symphony of Destruction have a randomized chance to cause an explosion, so these will only damage enemies in the area. A flak cannon, however, is very much intended to hit everything in the area, and will do so when used. Randomized chance at splash = only damage enemies, guaranteed splash = will damage everything.

Swapping loadouts more easily is something we've seen requested a number of times and have explored internally; there are some significant technical limitations that have made this far more difficult to implement than we'd like so it's not something we can guarantee will happen, but know that it's a nice-to-have we'd like to get to, if time allows.

Originally posted by compulsive_looter

Thank you very much for following up on this subject.

Just "ride" into Prescott and try to help the Okkar fight off random Outlaws with Symphony of Destruction and/or Crit Happens enabled and see what happens. I have no trouble reproducing this in my game.

Be that as it may, the most dangerous culprit by far is the 3/3 Vigilante set bonus. Surely you must have been able to verify this in your testing?

I can live with Bird's Nest behaving like other mines in that sense, now that I know it. I just somehow thought that its main trait "Web" may be less dangerous to neutrals. It's also hard to foresee the exact placement and size of the "Nest". But that's okay, I only use it on the Bomber anyway because it's so expensive to replenish lol.

As to [allied] Vipers exploding in my face, I will file that under "lessons learned" ;)

Ah, I see the confusion now. For all intents and purposes, Okkar are treated as hostile targets, made a bit more skittish due to their lore. As such, uncontrolled explosions will trigger them into fighting the player.

Otherwise, the Vigilante set EMP explosion bonus is one we are evaluating. It seems likely we'll adjust this.