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Does anyone has any idea or documentation to explain how ES leech cap works with Ghost Reaver (GR) + Vaal Pact (VP) + Vixen's entrapment interaction?

If we keep it simple with Life leech + VP + GR + CI, we have:

- Life leech caps at 20% of maximum life

- VP doubles it to cap at 40% of maximum life

- GR applies the life leeched to ES: 40% of maximum life gained as Energy Shield

- So ES gained = 40% of 1hp (CI) = 0.4hp gained per second

We have a problem, because this is clearly not how it works...

So GR must change the cap in the formula from a "% of maximum Life" to a "% of maximum ES".

This probably applies everywhere in the formula. Even VP's "Maximum Life leech rate is doubled" is changed to "Maximum ES leech rate is doubled" (according to PoB).

Then comes Vixen's entrapment, which provides ES leech (which if I'm not mistaken does not exist anywhere else).

- ES leech caps at 20% of maximum Energy Shield (default leech formula)

So in the end if you have Life leech + VP + GR + Vixen's entrapment and caps all leech (Life and ES leech), you should have:

- Life leech equal to 40% of maximum Energy Shield, but applied to Energy Shield

- ES leech equal to 20% of maximum Energy Shield

So you get a grand total of 60% of maximum ES gained as ES each second... (66% with Vitality Void), is that correct? Can anyone confirm it?

If it works like that, the Witch could even drop VP, still cap at 40% like today, but keep all the extra-points she had to expand to catch VP...

The other possibility is the wording of Ghost Reaver is wrong: instead of simply "Applying Life leech to Energy Shield" as it states, it could transform "Life Leech" to "ES Leech". Which is a strong possibility since it does transform the leech cap from Life to ES....

So, does anyone has any insight?

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about 5 years ago - /u/Mark_GGG - Direct link

Previously, PoE had no ES leech, but Ghost Reaver applied life leech to ES (in a specific way). That is no longer the case.

In 3.6.0, ES leech exists distinct from life leech, and is it's own thing. Ghost Reaver now works by making any effect that would give you life leech give you ES leech instead. Because this is ES Leech and not Life Leech, no modifiers that apply to Life Leech will affect it. Only modifiers to ES leech will affect it.

Vaal Pact only affects life leech, and thus has no interaction with ES leech.

The unique Soul Tether has a different mechanic, which is also changed. It lets you leech life, but while you're on full life, your life leech effects are not removed from you, and those life leech effects will recover energy shield rather than life. They are still life leech effects, not ES leech, and thus are scaled based on life, and affected by life leech modfiiers, not ES leech modifiers. This is so that item can continue to fulfill it's role of letting hybrid ES/life builds use life leech to recover both statuses.

about 5 years ago - /u/Mark_GGG - Direct link

Originally posted by dethan90

They are still life leech effects, not ES leech, and thus are scaled based on life, and affected by life leech modfiiers, not ES leech modifiers.

In 3.6, with an equipped Soul Tether on full life and using Bloodseeker (with it's instant life leech modifiers) will those modifiers apply to my ES ? Or is that unique mod not considered a "life leech modifier" in this context ?

You will leech life instantly, and recover ES instead from that instant leech when life is full. It will still be isntant.

Also, in contrast to the current mechanics, a single instance of life leech can bring you to full life and then apply the remainder of it's effect to ES (regardless of whether you make it instant or not), because it's only changing where the recovery goes, not anything about what the leech is.

In the previous version the excess from that leech was wasted, and when you next caused leech, because you were now on full life, the new leech was modified to apply to ES (because that was something that needed to be determined when the leech occured and couldn't change).

about 5 years ago - /u/Mark_GGG - Direct link

Originally posted by SirClueless

The unique Soul Tether has a different mechanic, which is also changed. It lets you leech life, but while you're on full life, your life leech effects are not removed from you, and those life leech effects will recover energy shield rather than life. They are still life leech effects, not ES leech, and thus are scaled based on life, and affected by life leech modfiiers, not ES leech modifiers.

Whaaaaaat?!

Some questions:

  1. Can you now gain life leech instances while at full life by hitting an enemy while wearing Soul Tether?
  2. Are life leech instances removed when you reach full ES?

Assuming 1. is yes and 2. is no, it sounds like you can get pseudo-Slayer/Ascendant Slayer leech by wearing Soul Tether and having a sizeable ES pool.

But even if not you can get a huge benefit now out of ES on any leech-based character by equipping Soul Tether. This is a huge change in my eyes, and it's what I've always wanted ever since seeing the belt spoiled.

Can you now gain life leech instances while at full life by hitting an enemy while wearing Soul Tether?

Yes -that's part of the effect of not removing them at full life. Besides, otherwise the item wouldn't work.

Are life leech instances removed when you reach full ES?

No, life leech effects are only ever removed at full life. If this does become a balance issue, we could change Soul Tether to remove them at full ES instead, but to my knowledge this hasn't happened yet.

about 5 years ago - /u/Mark_GGG - Direct link

Originally posted by Nickoladze

Thanks for making my belt stronger, Mark! We couldn't convert life leech instances into ES leech instances at the time it was made which was a pretty big disappointment.

Glad you like it! I was really happy when I came up with this solution to keep the belt working under the new system, and work for hybrid builds while only needing life leech modifiers (not also having to get ES leech ones).

It also has the side effect of making it much weaker with CI (because you're still doing life leech, both the maximum total leech rate, and the new maximum amount per leech are still based on your max life, which is 1), but it should work more smoothly with hybrid builds, which is the main point as I understand it.

about 5 years ago - /u/Mark_GGG - Direct link

Originally posted by skkrrtskkrrt

Is the wording on Ghost reaver going to be changed? Since it's the same as zealot's oath and "life regeneration per endurance charge" node scales with ES but the wording says maxmium life.

Is the wording on Ghost reaver going to be changed?

Yes.

about 5 years ago - /u/Mark_GGG - Direct link

Originally posted by Loraash

Well I guess this might be a little late for this but is Soul Tether going to have legacy variants with 3.6?

No. We changed what the existing stat it has already does (and how it's described).

about 5 years ago - /u/Mark_GGG - Direct link

Originally posted by hurix

So, in 3.6, do you determine the leech recovery target for each network frame?

From the Wiki of Soul Tether:

The second example is when a player takes chaos damage while on full life, and partially full energy shield. In this situation, any previously-created leech continues to recover to energy shield, while new instances of leech are sent to life. This will have the appearance of both pools leeching simultaneously.

These two pools won't leech simultaneously, as previously-created leech will "swap back" to recover life? Basicly making sure, life is always full before life leech recovery is applied to ES?

So, in 3.6, do you determine the leech recovery target for each network frame?

No, that would be entirely unecessary. If you have Soul Tether, when the "on full life" stat changes, that causes the stats for total life recovery per second and total ES recovery per second to both recalculate - and one of them (but not both) will include the total recovery from life leech stat in that recalculation, based on whether you're on full life or not.

So not every frame, only when the "full life" state changes.