Original Post — Direct link

Allow me to present the following point:

Currently in seige, there is an issue with rampant teamkilling toxicity (as well as team damaging toxicity) in both casual and ranked which is a direct result of every player being permitted to have one free teamkill and unlimited team damaging every match.

The current changes Ubisoft intends to implement (ie Damage Reflection) will come into effect after you perform a team kill.

Do you see the issue?

Damage Reflection does nothing to resolve the underlying problem that facilitates the ability to troll people by team killing them. Players can still get away with a free team kill every game as well as unlimited team damage (unless they unintentionally kill you while attempting to do so).

I appreciate that an effort is being made to address the issue but I feel the need to point out that this effort would be better spent on a solution that will have an actual effect.

Because based on the logic above, no effect will be had. Those abusing their free team kill can still abuse their free team kill.

I strongly suggest that Ubisoft move on from this idea and focus on a well designed Punish/Forgive system based on Halo's "press X to boot" system that takes the various differences and risks present in Siege vs Halo into account.

But one thing is clear. The system, no matter which form it takes, has to focus on preventing, disincentivizing and punishing the first teamkill as well as any deliberate team damaging that is attempted by toxic or trolling players.

EDIT: And a formal request, please do not downvote brigade this post because it isn't being positive enough or some other reason. All I am attempting to do is urge for a true solution to a significant issue in seige right now.

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about 4 years ago - /u/Ubi-Zoro - Direct link

There is currently a buffer in place to account for accidental TKs, you can TK 1 time in a match and not face a penalty. Accidents happen.

With the change, you'll now enter a special sanctioned status after that 1st TK, so now you won't even be able to damage your teammates, let alone TK another person. So there will still be a buffer for accidents, but now that 1st TK is not completely "free".

It's not a perfect, fix-all solution for toxicity but it is the next step that the team is implementing in the process.

about 4 years ago - /u/Ubi-Zoro - Direct link

Originally posted by FMW_Level_Designer

I understand that.

Yes, the new system will now come into effect immediately after a team kill, but it's that first team kill that causes all your issues because it's easily abusable.

No system is perfect but the changes do not address the issue at all, they simply change what the punishment is for team killing.

So while I do appreciate the effort being made by Ubisoft, it has to be pointed out that the effort will be largely ineffective if it's even effective at all. The developers involved in this are essentially wasting their time when they could be working on something much more effective.

The "buffer for accidents" is the entire problem and is what allows for the toxicity to occur and a system needs to be put in place that discourages and can punish the first team kill.

And as I said elsewhere, If I were to run a red light or dent another drivers car by accident I would expect to be punished for doing so.

If I teamkill by accident, I should still be punished in someway. This is why a "Press X to kick" is by and far the best solution as the victim of the teamkill or team damage is the one who gets to decide if the teamkiller ought to be punished, and that punishment is a kick from the game and potentially a ban upon repeated offense.


  • Actively discourages team killing at all

  • Puts in place an immediate and visible effect for the victim that allows them to act on it WITHOUT becoming equally toxic.

With modifications which would allow it to take effect when X amount of damage is dealt to teammates to prevent a teamkill entirely this would provide the most fair system possible.

I hope you can pass these points on to those developing the changes to at least allow them to evaluate my feedback themselves and decide if they would be better of focusing on changes that would have more of an effect.


A feature that lets you insta-kick someone for an accidental (or forced) TK would be just as abusable as the current or suggested reflective damage systems. A troll would just be able to force you to accidentally TK them, as they already do, and you'll then immediately be punished for that.

With the reflective damage system, that first TK is no longer "free" because you're immediately sanctioned for the rest of the match.

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