I have a question:
Is it possible that a guy can kill all 4 of his teammates and they keep "Forgiving" him? Will he still get kicked after 2 or 3 kills or will that system be entirely removed?
Like if I'm messing around with my friends, can they keep "forgiving" me while I kill all of them? Will I get punished regardless or no?
Yes, it's possible. If you keep TKing your teammates (who I hope are your friends), and they all mark it as an unintentional TK... then those TKs are not registered under the TK-kick system, and you won't be kicked.
I wouldn't suggest it though, unless you have very good friends.
New meta
- Kill one teammate
- Pick Fuze
- Team rushes objective amid active cluster charge
- Profit
The enemy can still kill you though. I feel like this would only be viable under extremely special circumstances (or the enemy forgets they are playing the game of rainbow six siege and lets you win a 4v5).
That being said, we're putting it on the TS first specifically to test and see what kinds of things come up. So try the strat out, tell us if it actually works, and leave us your feedback when it comes out on the TS. :D
Honestly it resolves very little.
It stops a Caviera downing everyone or a nitro cell blowing everyone up but it doesn't solve the most common TK, that being when they TK you once and don't do it to anyone else for the rest of the match.
So far as TK troll squads or salty teammates are concerned, they still get away with a free TK like they could before this update.
Before they would TK once and avoid shooting other players, which is exactly what they will be doing with damage reflection in the game.
It barely does anything to curb the toxicity.
So Ubisoft are basically wasting their time when they could be working on a Halo-eque "Boot for TKing" option instead which actively discourages TKing by having an immediate potential punishment for TKing the first time.
Trying to explain that to community manager was an effort in futility.
I'd like to think it's a step in the right direction towards addressing toxicity.
We're still working on ways to better address things like TK squads, but putting an immediate kick based on a single TK also leaves an opportunity to abuse and toxicity. As u/ubi-zoro pointed out, accidents happen, especially when you're in-game and under pressure to make split-second decisions and actions.
I saw you brought up the example of running a red light, but there are many signals and buffers in place to help warn you from running that stoplight. Yellow slow-down signs, the red brake lights of cars in front of you, actually seeing and upcoming stoplight many meters in front of you and being prepared for the light to change - you have quite a bit of time to see the signals, prepare yourself, and then begin to react. In-game, you have seconds to react, milliseconds even, in an environment where all other 9 members in game are instinctively reacting to anything and everything. Also important to note, the pressure we feel while driving is far less intense than the pressure we feel in-game.
I do appreciate your passion to see toxicity reduced, and we want that to happen as well - so hopefully you can understand a bit of where we are coming from and continue to give us constructive feedback now with a bit of our perspective.
Is there anything in regards to dealing damage to teammates, or is it just killing them?
We're looking into ways to put a stop to the 'chip-damage' style of toxicity as well, but the current Reverse FF system only activates when someone is outright TKed and marked as intentional.
What about situations where an accidental TK occurs, but the other player still decides to punish you? The dev blog mentioned tracking TK's and if necessary to place sanctions. Is this something that a team will review "tapes" of the gameplay to ensure a sanction is appropriate? Or will they simply tally the number of punishes without being able to determine that the punish was reasonable? I love seeing these steps being made, but I can easily see this being abused as well.
If the player declares the TK as intentional, even though you did not do it intentionally, it will still count as a TK as usual, and will go through the usual process of the TK system. The parameters we track around TKing are specifically designed to help us reasonably conclude that the TKing is a result of toxic behavior and not accidental. Of course we do a manual review prior to issuing sanctions to confirm, but there is not enough manpower in the world to manually review footage of every incident in a player's history.
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