[2021] IXWA Strike - Next major update - Rumor Round-Up and Discussion

Japan and Sweden have nowhere near the amount of jets the US has and will ever have in game. Those jets were only used by those nations and no other nations in game. They are important, iconic domestic vehicles.

You overlooked the primary reasoning. All F-5A production was intended for Military Assistance Program [MAP] and export, but the ones the US did take for use (such as the "Skoshi Tiger") were modified and later redesignated as F-5C. Those that were not, were used for training and exercises. So specifically the F-5A variant we have coming is the least applicable t

Yes, this is an F-5C, not an F-5A.

I have already said we are speaking specifically about the F-5A right now.

This is not an F-5E. Its an F-5A.

The aggressors are non combat trainers and movie stars. Im sure plenty of people will be making the iconic MiG-28 skin.

Again, those variants in combat over Vietnam used were not the standard A model we have coming and were indeed re-classified as C later on. Which is an option the USA can have. But the one coming is specifically an A.

As I said, there are already existing plans for the USA this patch on top of the fact that they have more jets than anyone else by a huge margin.

Other F-5 variants will be possible for them in the future.

Please see again. The F-5E has numerous visual changes that are not just "changing some numbers". Its not coming this patch.

F-5A is and as we have already made clear, there are options for the USA to receive the F-5 in the future. But not with this patch.

Not with this patch and thats all we are talking about here.

Its main operator will in future have the opportunity to get the later variants it actually operated more. Not the variant which was specifically designed to be an export fighter for other nations.

Made it for export and for use by other nations. It was designed and intended for the military assistance program to give US allies a capable fighter.

The USA already has more jets than anyone else in game. It has one of the top 3 jets in game, along with some of the most capable CAS jets and attack aircraft in game. On top of this, the USA has more to look forward too already thats not a jet it didn't use as much as other nations and designed for the purpose of giving to other nations.

They are the only nation in game currently that used it.

We will forward the first one onto the devs as an issue for review.

The second part may be possible, but isn't planned at least right now as the bulk of the % of things in game remain in and around the WW2 eras.

You will find out soon (ish).

The USA has the joint top most 10.0+ vehicles in game tied with Japan and Britain. On top of this, it has some of the most competitive jets in game at several BRs.

The F-5 was made "iconic" by its role in a film, aggressor squadrons and is more popular with those nations that actually operated it than it was with the US at the time. It was designed specifically for export. Not US operation.

Whilst the US did operate later variants and modifications, the F-5A was predominantly used in export countries. In US service, it was only training, research and trials. Therefor th

Again, the F-5A is not an iconic US variant. Its the export version intended for other nations to use. Not the USA. The US tree will have the option of more relevant variants in the future.

Indeed I did. You will also notice that I have said the US has other things to look forward to this update. The US in general gets more jet aircraft than all other nations and that will generally always be the case.

But in this instance, this variant has no reason to be in the US tree when later variants are ones actually used in large numbers operationally by the USA. F-5C and F-5E are far more relevant and famous.

F-5A is the specific export version. The aircraft itself was designed not for US use, but for their allies.

We are adding a vehicle

The ones that saw combat were the F-5C. They were modified F-5As, but not the same.

its not a copy paste and not merely a redesignation. Several modifications were made and as I said, US variants are planned. The US is going to get something else this update. So we are not dropping all plans when we already have plans made for US F-5s. The F-5A is not a variant they used.

It is more natural that the US is going to get more jets than everyone else. This will always be the case.

It does not mean they automatically also get the things the

I do understand the perspective and understand the frustration. Thats why we were quick to assure that this variant, is just the first one to join the game. We generally always work chronologically with variants. We dont usually start with the later ones and work backwards.

In this case, the F-5A variant is the first and its the one the US didn't want. They made it specifically for export. To give to other nations to boost their abilities. The A models the US did take, they used solely for training and research. The handful that did see combat, first underwent modifications and be

Nope. Quite a lot of things are not yet ready. So you probably wont see it for over a week or so.

That said, the F-5A was my second favourite this update

The people that researched the US tree with the expectation of getting an F-5 have no reason to be disappointed. Because as we said, one day its likely they will get a version they used and is more relevant too them. But right now, the F-5A is not that version. Its the one intended for export and mostly used by other nations.

Nobody has said the US is never getting an F-5, simply they are not currently going to get the F-5A variant that was meant for the export market.

There are exceptions. Like the Starfighters. All of which were introduced at once as they were the focus of the patch.

T-2K is the specific armed fighter-bomber version. Not the sole jet trainer. Its also used by nobody else in game and Japan has 1/4 of the jets open to them that the US does.

This is also not the primary reason for the F-5A not coming to the US tree. F-5A was the main export model. The US have more relevant versions that are possible later.

It isn't coming instead of or over than. Other J-7 variants are more than possible. But the F-5A is ready and whats coming now.

Both were used for training, but specifically the T-2K was a combat capable aircraft and lead to the development of the F-1. You are also not considering the T-2K is a domestic jet used solely by Japan and one of their only options at top tier alongside the F-1. Meanwhile the US has 4x the options.

The F-5s the US used in combat were the "skoshi tiger" or F-5C. They were modified As and not the same as the version we have coming to the game this update. This version was not used in combat by the US at all. So there is no reason to give the USA the main export version when they can

No I did not.

I didn't take down your comment, I took down a status update you left on my profile ranting about the F-5A.

Ive already explained in detail how the F-5A variant, is the export model intended for use by other nations.

USA only used it for training and later on, can get the versions it actually used in larger numbers and more significantly. The F-5A is the least American version. The used the F-5C and E and neither of those are the version coming to the game right now.

Nope. Because again, they were US tanks also tested by America and Britain has more than enough domestic vehicles already in that area and to come.

This has 0 relation to the F-5A

We never promised them. We gave the community an option several years ago that we either drastically slow down vehicle production in favour of fully detailed c*ckpits (1 bomber c*ckpit = 3-4 complete fighter aircraft with interiors for example) or continue working on vehicles and give all bombers placeholder c*ckpits with basic dials and shape with the option of perhaps adding more c*ckpits later if the opportunities arise. The single biggest fact, is the cost in resources for c*ckpits and how much it would impact developement are not justified by the amount of people that actually use them.

And this resulted in the question to the community and the decision to introduce placeholders only as per the result

So this picture predates that unless this is that very change were placeholders were introduced.

Because its an entirely different model that has to be developed. F-5A is the first early variant. Its possible others can come later.

The USA used the F-104A and C extensively. Thats why they got those versions.

The context of that was specific variants of the same aircraft. Seperate vehicles can be added in any order to fill gaps.

Again. You dont just magic a full aircraft model up like that. They take months of development. We have said the F-5A is the variant thats ready now. Others have the possibility to come in the future.

F-5A is the early version. F-5E is a far more advanced and entirely different later version.

Thats great and all but you quoted my post about regarding the F-104A not F-5A.

Your point is fully understood about the F-5E, except you seem to miss the part that the version coming to the game is the F-5A. F-5E is a later variant and an entirely different model.

Thank you, this is actually my second job so its not all day for me.

My day job is in injection moulding, so nobody is going ballistic over F-5s there )))

Nobody said the F-5E was "too much". Thats not the reason why its not coming.

F-5A is the version coming right now. Other variants may come later.

We asked extensively for feedback on the forums and at the time Reddit. Anton or Krill also made a direct post about it at the time. We did ask and took a direct consensus. Overwhelmingly people didn't want all other vehicle development to stop in favour of bomber c*ckpits. Coupled with the fact hardly anyone uses them the decision was reached based on all of this.

Venom was developed from Vampire. It's not a variant of the same plane. But an improvement

Still the case. I will be flying mine in glorious MIG-28 colours as soon as someone makes a user skin ))

It's inside the British tree so no it can't be. Also South African vehicles have no real relation to France at all other than the guns. That's like saying everything armed with a British L7 105 of variant of it should be in the British tree.

We have Rooikats in the British tree for some time now. Just because a vehicle or two might have a French designed cannon, doesn't mean France gets it.

Right now it's not a Commonwealth tree. It has commonwealth vehicles in it, but vehicles like the Leopard C2 MEXAS are German and belong with Germany.

What about it? It's a German event reward vehicle as it was mostly German and won't be moving to the British tree for now.

Still does not make them French. Lots of nations share components

France is just not a logical home for South African tanks.

That would be the case if we were talking about just a couple of centurions. But we are not. We already have 2 Rooikats in the British tree and their vehicles overall have more links to the UK than France. So the subnation needs to go into a singular place and that's the UK tree.

Good thing we are not just talking about cold war technology then as you just made that assumption. But also other eras that France had 0 relation to whatsoever

South Africa =/= France

All will be clear soon.

As for class 3 I've already answered this. It's a German reward vehicle and will remain that way.

If you read the post I quoted you would see it was claimed the UK tree is getting French vehicles. Which it is not. It's getting South African.

The bulk of their forces are Rooikats and the main tanks are the Olifants. Neither of which are French.

That's also again assuming it's just cold war stuff. When we haven't even shown everything yet.

So perhaps it's best to take a step back. Wait and see what's actually coming before coming to assumed conclusions without all the facts.

Branch or line. Whatever you wish to call it. It's a 5th one for the British tree.

Not in this patch.

One that's not yet been seen ))

Let's be real here. Where ever almost any vehicle that's not directly domestic goes, someone is going to be upset.

Rather than focus on who gets what. Perhaps let's just enjoy the vehicles and nations they represent?

This constant one-upmanship is never going to make anyone feel better.

The UK is not getting a single French vehicle. The bulk of what's coming is directly tied to the British and since we are introducing South Africa as a sub branch it all needs to go in one place.

We are not splitting the tree up to throw France something that's not French and just has French components.

Nope. We have had the Rooikats for some time now and most SA vehicles are surrounding that type of vehicle along with the key tanks being Centurions.

As I said, the bulk of what's coming is tied to the British. We are not splitting the tree up for those vehicles that do happen to have French elements.

That's the whole point of introducing a tree.

It implies the same thing.

National "tech" is spread all over. Nations buy off each other, capture technology and develop it for themselves.

Like a lot of postwar French tanks that took a lot on from late war German tanks

Not really. Since SA can support a whole line of unique vehicles. Israel can't really do that and most Canadian tanks were just British or American until postwar. Then they go more German.

It's a full tree line. Whatever you want to call it is besides the point. SA is under a single line and all in one place.

Exception being the Class 3 which was actually German made and not adopted by SA.

Licence built means that nation has the right to build it as their own. Like the Mitsubishi Sabres and other things. We don't have those in the US tree.

Again, it's like saying every licence built British L7 is instant property of the UK tree.

Nobody said anything about that going in the UK tree.

Some nations, like South Africa can support a branch from rank 1 upwards without the need for any existing "copy paste" which is the biggest negative people have whenever we introduce a new nation. Others like Israel would be essentially all copy/paste from ranks I - III/IV. Even China could support unique vehicles across those ranks.

The reality is, we simply cant give every nation a whole tree or even a full branch. But its better they are represented in game in some form than not at all.

It is. But you will have to wait for that.

Thundershow is already live?

https://warthunder.com/en/news/7055-video-thunder-show-all-according-to-plan-en

The devs have already explained there are no plans to do a nation starting from Rank V and linked to 2 nations.

A sub nation comes like South Africa does.

The dev stream is to show some of the major things in the patch. Not everything.

Some things are also not ready to show yet.

Its the test server. Not final. Things like stat cards / flags are always bugged.

Stay tuned to the news next week.

A German origin Leopard 2 developed by Germany and Poland for use by Poland has no place in the US tree.

Germany already has the Canadian Leopard MEXAS

Eland is South African and thus going into the South African sub tree where it belongs.

SK-105 is Austrian who are closest to Germany. Only the turret is French. The chassis is Austrian.

I have no idea why my nationality is relevant here.

I am a Community Manager explaining the facts from the developers to you.

The South African tree is being added. So there is no reason at all to remove vehicles from it and take it away from the tree itself.

The Buccaneer in game never carried Martels. It was later models.

Nope

Simply explaining how its not automatically French property because it uses a French turret.

France has its own domestic vehicles to look forward too in the future.

We have also not shown the whole contents of the patch yet.

Squadron.

Thank you, but as Ive said before the devs are aware of the aircraft. S.2 is simply the first variant for now.

Except no it cant because thats a technology demonstrator with basically no public information right now

If we were to have Austrian vehicles, their closest tree would be Germany.

The same reason Finland is with Sweden.

Its Austrian. Austria is and generally always has been closest to Germany more than anyone else.

The hull and the power unit are Austrian. It also has Israeli parts, the gun is manufactured in Austria under license. Ammunition is also a similar situation. The turret visually is the FL-12 tower, however It is assembled in Austria and completely independently from domestic materials. Austria, is tied closer to Germany than to France in every sense.

Its not Botswanian.

S.2 was the first major version after the troublesome S.1. We generally always start with the most significant variant when we plan to expand further later.

We started with that as it coincided with the new HMS Ark Royal:

They have their historical monocolour camo too. These are just extra camos.

Austria is closest in game to Germany. Thus Austrian native vehicles will go into the German tree. The vehicle isn't French. The parts that were of French origin were licence built in Austria.

Austria has a deep historical allied connection to Germany. Just like Finland with Sweden.

Except its an entirely German made vehicle with a German armour package.

SK 105 is domestically Austrian.

Its the most logical tree for Austrian vehicles to join. They have no relation to France other than the parts that were licence built in Austria anyway.

American made solely for export. The only A models the USA had were for training those pilots from nations who purchased the A. Other than that, they were the modified C version used in combat.

US will have its own more meaningful variants it used for itself in the future.

They designed it, then sold it under licence to Austria who produced it all themselves.

There is no Rooikat in the German tree. Only the class 3 which was German designed, produced and never adopted by South Africa.

Both of the nations of those vehicles do not have a tree in game. Therefor they go in the most relevant tree applicable.

MEXAS was German designed, German produced and is a Leopard in full. Therefor it goes into the German tree.

Class 3P was German designed, German produced and not adopted by South Africa. Therefor it goes into the German tree.

F-5A was designed by America specifically for export to allied nations and one of those nations is in game, used it in large numbers and is entirely historical. The USA will get the F-5 variants it actually used in

Argentina is not in game. Therefor Germany is most relevant.

The nations linked to that, except the UK who also tested it themselves are not in game. Therefor Britain is most relevant.

Because its not French. France will have its own vehicles. Austrian domestic vehicles will go into the German tree.

The devs are. There is something very significant in progress for France, but not ready right now. Its planned for this update and we hope to share more news on it soon.

We already said no new Draken some time ago.

Both domestically designed and tested. There is no reason not to have them in game when they are interesting and well used machines in game.

When we are ready to announce it we will. We do not spoil something ahead of time, epically when its not ready yet.

When its on the dev server to test please. Reporting of of the dev streams it no use at all really.

We (CMs) do not set BRs.

BRs visible in dev server are not set in stone and are subject to change (like everything in DEV).

We will need some sort of source / factual basis to pass it to the devs for consideration. One persons word is not a valid source.

This is not a Squadron Vehicle point distribution topic.

It's really so hard for you to understand purpose of "IXWA Strike - Next major update - Rumor Round-Up and Discussion" thread?

Since some time we do not reveal everything on streams/dev opening.

It doesn't mean yes or no. Simply have this on mind.

Actually there will be. For our friends with rotors.

There is nothing forced about this update

We typically have 5 updates a year and if you are a member of the "old guard" you would be well aware of that by now that a major happens around this time.

Planned yes. Coming this update no.

Doesn't really mean anything, we sitll have things not seen yet that likely wont be on a dev server whenever we have one.

Actual proof would be needed. Not a drawing.