devtrackers.gg
Hey,
this is my first post on the forum and normally I wouldn't care too much about PTS changes. Things get nerfed, the same things get buffed again, new PvP sets etc. Normally I just change my setups and adapt.
This time though I felt the need to express my concerns about the new changes.
I'm a mid-tier player. I'm not really casual but I'm definitely not an endgame player. My friends and I play dungeons and trials and sometimes we PvP a bit but we never go for score-pushing or worlds first etc.. We just look for titles, colors, and other rewards and try to do the content to get it. Especially for achievements that are tied to housing stuff, the dragons from vSS hm are amazing and we had a lot of fun decorating.
Atm we're proging GS. We managed to do vSS hm a couple of weeks ago and are now trying to die less and to be faster so we can try to go after the trifecta and get the mount. While it looks like it's gonna take a bit of time we are confident we can pull it off with enough time. Our vSS hm runs are getting better and we can now do them with not too many wipes.
Our raid lead was reading a bit about the upcoming changed and suggested we try out vSS hm and see how different it is on PTS before we're all gonna lose our minds over it. Maybe it is a bad patch, maybe it is not too bad and we can simply adjust and go after GS again. So our raid lead thought it would be important to test it out.
So we tried vSS hm yesterday and... it didn't go well. All of a sudden we had trouble doing enough DPS to the boss and to the mobs and therefore our tank and our healers were struggling to keep us alive. It took so much longer to kill stuff that I'm not sure we can do a speed run now.
So DPS was down. Okay, maybe we can adjust? But then again, we don't know how atm. Again, we're not endgamers. We don't know all the insides and outside of the game, you can't wake us in the middle of the night and ask us what sets does [xxx] and expect an answer. We need a bit of help from endgamers and people who know the game better than us. Ideas so we can look for new sets or skills or whatever. And I have no problem asking for help. But now it looks like we get quite a few changes so that we can't just tweak some stuff here and there and then hit the boss with the same DPS we did before. And this is disheartening. When you managed to do a trial hm and now it looks like you can't? That is not fun. And ESO is not our job, we don't want to relearn everything from scratch so we can do the same content we did before. It simply is not fun. And there is also no say that we're gonna do the same damage before the next patch hits and we have to do everything all over again.
The other thing we noticed was healing. Our healers were now struggling to keep us alive with the HoT changes. The damage the boss and the mobs were doing were the same, but healing was low and slow with the same set up so that we had problems healing the ice tomb and therefore wiping everyone.
Also with the DPS down we had problems doing the portals in time. In the end we couldn't finish vSS hm anymore and called it a day. Needless to say our prog group is now feeling down after this encounter.
Lokkestiiz – Biggest problems for us with the changes:
Ice Tombs; loosing too much health and having problems healing it up so we don't explode. We changed tactics, two healers healing the person up and tank using selfish sets but fight took a lot longer and was less enjoyable
Pulse Damage; had problems healing this as well, in the end we had 2 DDs using Barrier and that helped a lot
Yolnahkriin – Biggest problems for us with the changes:
Fight took a lot longer than it did on live
Healing was a bit of an issue again, but not as bad as the first boss, explosions were harder to heal
Nahviintaas – Biggest problems for us with the changes:
Healing was again one our biggest problems with the 2 sec HoT duration, our healers which are pretty good for our grp normally on live now struggled hard to keep us alive, these changes were the most brutal for them
Our Off-Tank also had to use more selfish sets so the statue wouldn't knock him out but it went better than we expected, tanks were doing okay-ish in all fights
Downstairs was always a wipe, we couldn't finish the miniboss in 90 seconds before he killed us, our damage which was high enough in live is now not high enough for this encounter anymore
General damage wasn't high enough anymore and now we struggle with the last boss we could beat normally on live
(And we also noticed that the longer the fight took the worse the instance seemed to get? Performance wise it seemed like the instance was degenerating.)
So from my perspective as a mid-tier player, I dislike the changes. A lot.
I get what you're trying to do and I agree that more casual players need more accessibility to do hard dungeons and trials. Heck, even us mid-tiers would need that. But whatever this patch is... it's not doing that.
We all want more people joining raids and dungeons. Our group would love to see more faces and maybe have a second group running. It would make our day if the people we like and that play with us would get awesome rewards. Imagine more people getting skins or colors or even mounts. That would be awesome! But now it just seems like some peeps like us will just be left behind.
When you talked about accessibility I thought something along the lines of help people get groups or help them make build or whatever. Maybe new sets that helped other playstyles.
Project Vitality from @Nefas for example was a very good idea, I had some good runs with people (also did one of the newer trials for the first time) and had two people who had Godslayer explain to me what our group could do get there. Again, I don't know the ins and outs of the game so people taking the time to explain to me how we could make things better was pretty great.
What I would've loved to see would be the devs and/or the combat team maybe explain things. Like either have streams of explanation videos of some stuff. Like doing a GS/PB/SB run and explain mechanics, explain what DPS/Healing/Tankiness is needed, give some set recommendations (that are ofc not limited to that), maybe make a video explaining how to make your own rotation or how to make your own build. Maybe ideas what to do when you are struggling with certain things.
Maybe find a way to make finding a group easier. Again, Project Vitality makes finding a trial grp easier. Idk if a trial grp finder is the way but other peeps will maybe have some ideas.
I get that the damage can't go up forever. Imagine seeing @skinnycheeks parsing and he just does like a million damage per second (which would be funny tbh). But at the same time reducing damage (and healing which was the hardest change for us) to the point that old content we managed to do now so hard that we can't beat the last boss does not seem like making the game more accessible. Still think Oakensoul was a very good way to help people close the gap (though I agree it needed some adjustments in PvP). One of our raiders has a muscle disease that makes it difficult for him to push buttons, doing something that is 'too' repeatable makes his muscle clench. His build got gutted pretty bad and we noticed that 'spammable' builds were you put down your dots and only use your spammable were doing a lot of more damage. He tried it and his muscles in his hands clenched and he had problems playing with us. Atm we're looking to find another build for him that would work with the PTS changes but again we are not the super experienced players so it's gonna take some time. And this mate deserves the achievement so much because he put so much effort into our runs!
Our grp will not quit the game atm, we're gonna try to get our GS until the next update and keep a look at the upcoming patch notes. But also if it looks like this version or at least some capacity of this version makes it to live we're gonna have a break from the game. Seeing how many combat changes we had in the past I'm pretty sure we will have some kind of power creep coming again and therefore make it easier for us to do the content. It always happens. But since this patch looks like it's not gonna be fun we're not keen of pushing content for 3 months so that the combat gets changed yet again.
Also what about the other grp content like vKA hm, vRG hm and vDSR hm? Since they are new they tend to be a lot harder than the older content. And even older content like vSO hm could become a lot harder with the poison phase.
Also maybe they should not do the giant changes in one go. Maybe try LA/HA changes first and then see how it goes, maybe then DoT changes, then class changes. These big changes also make it hard to see what we have to optimize again. If it were only LA/HA for example we could see how much it affects us and then adjust. Now with everything it just seems like a hot mess.
I really hope that ZOS finds a way to balance things out and make content more accessible for all players (maybe even add a colorblind mode for people like me). We need new and more people doing trials and dungeons but maybe not at the cost of mid-tier players like our GS group.
Cheers to all and thank you @ZOS_Kevin for keeping an eye on our feedback.
P.S. This is just my personal view as a mid-tier player and this does not mean I'm right about these things. After testing in week 1 and 2 this is just how our grp perceives this and no one of us wants to paint the game in a super bad way. We love ESO that is why I thought it would be important to voice my opinion on this. I want this game to succeed in every way and that it stays around for a long time but it also means that if I (or another grp of players) think these changes will be bad for the game... we have to voice our opinion. If you are a casual player or a mid-tier like me or even one of the best players there is... I also want to hear your opinion. Maybe we can all find a common ground even if we disagree on these changes to ESO can stay the amazing game it is.
Also english is not my native language so bear with me.
Thank you for readinf and keep testing!
this is my first post on the forum and normally I wouldn't care too much about PTS changes. Things get nerfed, the same things get buffed again, new PvP sets etc. Normally I just change my setups and adapt.
This time though I felt the need to express my concerns about the new changes.
I'm a mid-tier player. I'm not really casual but I'm definitely not an endgame player. My friends and I play dungeons and trials and sometimes we PvP a bit but we never go for score-pushing or worlds first etc.. We just look for titles, colors, and other rewards and try to do the content to get it. Especially for achievements that are tied to housing stuff, the dragons from vSS hm are amazing and we had a lot of fun decorating.
Atm we're proging GS. We managed to do vSS hm a couple of weeks ago and are now trying to die less and to be faster so we can try to go after the trifecta and get the mount. While it looks like it's gonna take a bit of time we are confident we can pull it off with enough time. Our vSS hm runs are getting better and we can now do them with not too many wipes.
Our raid lead was reading a bit about the upcoming changed and suggested we try out vSS hm and see how different it is on PTS before we're all gonna lose our minds over it. Maybe it is a bad patch, maybe it is not too bad and we can simply adjust and go after GS again. So our raid lead thought it would be important to test it out.
So we tried vSS hm yesterday and... it didn't go well. All of a sudden we had trouble doing enough DPS to the boss and to the mobs and therefore our tank and our healers were struggling to keep us alive. It took so much longer to kill stuff that I'm not sure we can do a speed run now.
So DPS was down. Okay, maybe we can adjust? But then again, we don't know how atm. Again, we're not endgamers. We don't know all the insides and outside of the game, you can't wake us in the middle of the night and ask us what sets does [xxx] and expect an answer. We need a bit of help from endgamers and people who know the game better than us. Ideas so we can look for new sets or skills or whatever. And I have no problem asking for help. But now it looks like we get quite a few changes so that we can't just tweak some stuff here and there and then hit the boss with the same DPS we did before. And this is disheartening. When you managed to do a trial hm and now it looks like you can't? That is not fun. And ESO is not our job, we don't want to relearn everything from scratch so we can do the same content we did before. It simply is not fun. And there is also no say that we're gonna do the same damage before the next patch hits and we have to do everything all over again.
The other thing we noticed was healing. Our healers were now struggling to keep us alive with the HoT changes. The damage the boss and the mobs were doing were the same, but healing was low and slow with the same set up so that we had problems healing the ice tomb and therefore wiping everyone.
Also with the DPS down we had problems doing the portals in time. In the end we couldn't finish vSS hm anymore and called it a day. Needless to say our prog group is now feeling down after this encounter.
Lokkestiiz – Biggest problems for us with the changes:
Ice Tombs; loosing too much health and having problems healing it up so we don't explode. We changed tactics, two healers healing the person up and tank using selfish sets but fight took a lot longer and was less enjoyable
Pulse Damage; had problems healing this as well, in the end we had 2 DDs using Barrier and that helped a lot
Yolnahkriin – Biggest problems for us with the changes:
Fight took a lot longer than it did on live
Healing was a bit of an issue again, but not as bad as the first boss, explosions were harder to heal
Nahviintaas – Biggest problems for us with the changes:
Healing was again one our biggest problems with the 2 sec HoT duration, our healers which are pretty good for our grp normally on live now struggled hard to keep us alive, these changes were the most brutal for them
Our Off-Tank also had to use more selfish sets so the statue wouldn't knock him out but it went better than we expected, tanks were doing okay-ish in all fights
Downstairs was always a wipe, we couldn't finish the miniboss in 90 seconds before he killed us, our damage which was high enough in live is now not high enough for this encounter anymore
General damage wasn't high enough anymore and now we struggle with the last boss we could beat normally on live
(And we also noticed that the longer the fight took the worse the instance seemed to get? Performance wise it seemed like the instance was degenerating.)
So from my perspective as a mid-tier player, I dislike the changes. A lot.
I get what you're trying to do and I agree that more casual players need more accessibility to do hard dungeons and trials. Heck, even us mid-tiers would need that. But whatever this patch is... it's not doing that.
We all want more people joining raids and dungeons. Our group would love to see more faces and maybe have a second group running. It would make our day if the people we like and that play with us would get awesome rewards. Imagine more people getting skins or colors or even mounts. That would be awesome! But now it just seems like some peeps like us will just be left behind.
When you talked about accessibility I thought something along the lines of help people get groups or help them make build or whatever. Maybe new sets that helped other playstyles.
Project Vitality from @Nefas for example was a very good idea, I had some good runs with people (also did one of the newer trials for the first time) and had two people who had Godslayer explain to me what our group could do get there. Again, I don't know the ins and outs of the game so people taking the time to explain to me how we could make things better was pretty great.
What I would've loved to see would be the devs and/or the combat team maybe explain things. Like either have streams of explanation videos of some stuff. Like doing a GS/PB/SB run and explain mechanics, explain what DPS/Healing/Tankiness is needed, give some set recommendations (that are ofc not limited to that), maybe make a video explaining how to make your own rotation or how to make your own build. Maybe ideas what to do when you are struggling with certain things.
Maybe find a way to make finding a group easier. Again, Project Vitality makes finding a trial grp easier. Idk if a trial grp finder is the way but other peeps will maybe have some ideas.
I get that the damage can't go up forever. Imagine seeing @skinnycheeks parsing and he just does like a million damage per second (which would be funny tbh). But at the same time reducing damage (and healing which was the hardest change for us) to the point that old content we managed to do now so hard that we can't beat the last boss does not seem like making the game more accessible. Still think Oakensoul was a very good way to help people close the gap (though I agree it needed some adjustments in PvP). One of our raiders has a muscle disease that makes it difficult for him to push buttons, doing something that is 'too' repeatable makes his muscle clench. His build got gutted pretty bad and we noticed that 'spammable' builds were you put down your dots and only use your spammable were doing a lot of more damage. He tried it and his muscles in his hands clenched and he had problems playing with us. Atm we're looking to find another build for him that would work with the PTS changes but again we are not the super experienced players so it's gonna take some time. And this mate deserves the achievement so much because he put so much effort into our runs!
Our grp will not quit the game atm, we're gonna try to get our GS until the next update and keep a look at the upcoming patch notes. But also if it looks like this version or at least some capacity of this version makes it to live we're gonna have a break from the game. Seeing how many combat changes we had in the past I'm pretty sure we will have some kind of power creep coming again and therefore make it easier for us to do the content. It always happens. But since this patch looks like it's not gonna be fun we're not keen of pushing content for 3 months so that the combat gets changed yet again.
Also what about the other grp content like vKA hm, vRG hm and vDSR hm? Since they are new they tend to be a lot harder than the older content. And even older content like vSO hm could become a lot harder with the poison phase.
Also maybe they should not do the giant changes in one go. Maybe try LA/HA changes first and then see how it goes, maybe then DoT changes, then class changes. These big changes also make it hard to see what we have to optimize again. If it were only LA/HA for example we could see how much it affects us and then adjust. Now with everything it just seems like a hot mess.
I really hope that ZOS finds a way to balance things out and make content more accessible for all players (maybe even add a colorblind mode for people like me). We need new and more people doing trials and dungeons but maybe not at the cost of mid-tier players like our GS group.
Cheers to all and thank you @ZOS_Kevin for keeping an eye on our feedback.
P.S. This is just my personal view as a mid-tier player and this does not mean I'm right about these things. After testing in week 1 and 2 this is just how our grp perceives this and no one of us wants to paint the game in a super bad way. We love ESO that is why I thought it would be important to voice my opinion on this. I want this game to succeed in every way and that it stays around for a long time but it also means that if I (or another grp of players) think these changes will be bad for the game... we have to voice our opinion. If you are a casual player or a mid-tier like me or even one of the best players there is... I also want to hear your opinion. Maybe we can all find a common ground even if we disagree on these changes to ESO can stay the amazing game it is.
Also english is not my native language so bear with me.
Thank you for readinf and keep testing!