[2022] Planned economy changes in February

Revision of the bonus reward for victory and defeat

In the recent economy updates, we described the mechanics of earning Silver Lions and Research points, and proposed that you vote for one of the possible variants to change the bonus rewards at the end of a mission. This was followed by the second stage of voting in order to make the final decision with confidence. These are the results:

What RP reward distribution during a battle do you want to have in War Thunder?

56.7% 一 0.8 RP/sec for defeat and 1.2 RP/sec for victory


43.3% 一 0.6 RP/sec for defeat and 1.4 RP/sec for victory (same as before)

What SL reward distribution do you want to have in War Thunder?

66.1% 一 +20% for defeat and +47% for victory


33.9% 一 +0% for defeat and +67% for victory (same as before)

Thus, the bonus reward for defeat and victory in mission will be revised in accordance to the vote results. The changes will be deployed with an economic update, which we will announce later.

Discussion on switching to the new economy model

Currently, the game features an economy model with a calculation of economic parameters for mid- and high tier vehicles based on the efficiency statistic for each vehicle. Efficiency is the sum of Silver Lions earned without taking into account the reward multiplier, Premium account, boosters, achievements and mission bonuses for the given time, divided by the number of deaths on this vehicle for the same period of time. That is, the more active rewardable actions are performed by players (hits, critical damage, kill assists, destruction of enemies, points captures, damaging and destruction of enemy bases), and the less often they lose their vehicles, the higher the efficiency is. The system is used in the game for most of its existence due to the specifics of gameplay. We may balance the vehicles by changing their technical characteristics very rarely and through a very limited range as this may contravene historical data that we rely on when we create the vehicles. As a rule, we balance vehicles by the Battle Rating (BR), but we can only change it within certain ranges due to the features of the given vehicle. For example, the vehicles with modern ATGMs with high armour penetration value can’t be below a certain BR level, even when their efficiency is low. The same is true for the early heavy tanks with good armour protection that can not be set with too high a BR, due to a weak gun.

This inevitably leads to a situation where some of the vehicles find themselves in more preferable conditions, they are more comfortable to play and much more effective on their tier. While others can not equally rival with opponents and are far less fun to play. The current economy system (hereinafter, it will be referred to as the "vehicle efficiency economy") is built in such a way, that playing in a less effective vehicle is more profitable on average to avoid the “double punishment” - gameplay and economic - from the inefficient vehicle. At the same time, playing the more effective vehicles is more risky, and requires player skills to achieve a decent reward after deducting the repair costs.

However, with the growth of the vehicle number and the addition of new gaming nations, the uneven use of certain vehicles also grows. Some nations and vehicles are much more popular among players and this affects the efficiency statistics. Therefore, we are considering the option of introducing a new economic system, which will be completely based on the position of the vehicle in the research tree (rank and position at a rank relative to other vehicles). Further in the text, such an economy will be referred to as "the rank based economy". Such a system was originally used in the game for vehicles of initial ranks (currently these are ranks I and II, and also partially III and IV).

The potential transition to the rank based economy will also cause another noticeable change - the reduction of the maximum repair cost. Due to the constant growth of the number of high tier vehicles and the number of tiers themselves, the rank based economy requires revision of the repair costs and multipliers for all mid- and high-tier vehicles. Instead, we are planning to set these parameters on the almost fixed level for vehicles of ranks VI+ in order to minimize the following economic adjustments. In this case, the number of economy-equivalent vehicles will be quite big (all vehicles of ranks VI, VII, and following), and will be constantly growing. Keeping the current max repair costs level for such a number of vehicles would be wrong, so it requires a reduction.

Before comparing two economic approaches in numbers, it is necessary first to recall one of the features of the economy updates - the normalization of the economic parameters for vehicles. The normalization limits the maximum available change of economic parameters in every economy update in order to smooth the transition to the target values, as well as to avoid harsh changes for vehicles, whose efficiency may vary over time.
Thus, two tables are presented to compare the two economies:

with normalization of the values that allows a comparison of the two economies in the next economic update that is scheduled for February. Here you can also compare the parameters for a specific vehicle in the next economic update, depending on the economy used.


without normalization of values that allows the comparison of two economies at the target values that economic parameters would hypothetically reach for a significant number of economic updates for current vehicles at their current performance. We are not providing target values with details on specific vehicles, as these are hypothetical indicators that change with each subsequent upload of statistics.

In general it is needed to note the following pros and cons of each economy for players:

Vehicle efficiency economy:

(+) On average lossless play in less efficient vehicles of rank IV or higher without premium account.


(-) Vehicles of the less popular game nations are often the most efficient and as a result unprofitable.

Rank based economy:

(+) Repair cost and reward multipliers are identical for similar vehicles of different game nations.


(+) There is a clear correlation between economic parameters (repair cost, reward multipliers, reward for useful actions) and position in the research tree.


(-) Decrease in the demand for less efficient vehicles as they will become economically equivalent to more effective vehicles of the same rank which may also lead to the decrease in the variety of vehicles in the battles.

Generalized key differences between the rank based and vehicle efficiency economies can be summarized as follows:

greater reward multiplier for popular high ranked vehicles;


lower repair cost for unpopular medium-ranked vehicles;


higher repair cost for popular high ranked vehicles;


lower reward multiplier for unpopular medium-ranked vehicles.

Let us make some specific examples comparing the target indicators (not for the next economy update but for the final implementation for a hypothetically large number of economy updates at the current level of statistics) of the economy by the vehicle rank and the economy by the vehicle efficiency for vehicles discussed in the community:

base repair cost for T95 in AB will be 8360 SL instead of 17010 SL with a reward multiplier of 1.1 vs 1.3;


base repair cost for Strv 121 in RB will be 5350 SL instead of 7740 SL with a reward multiplier of 1.5 vs 1.6;


base repair cost for Tu-4 in RB will be 12570 SL instead of 30170 SL with a reward multiplier of 2.3 vs 1.8;


base repair cost for F-5A in RB will be 10210 SL instead of 5720 SL with a reward multiplier of 3.8 vs 2.9;


base repair cost for “Parizhskaya kommuna” in RB will be 28430 SL instead of 50860 SL with a reward multiplier of 2.0 vs 2.3.


base repair cost for F-86A-5 and CL-13 Mk.4 (Italy) in RB will be 11290 and 12410 SL instead of 6950 and 10490 SL respectively.

We would like to invite the War Thunder community to vote for one of the economy model described above - economy by vehicle efficiency (current system) or economy by vehicle rank.

[ Vote ]

Changes of the reward multipliers, repair cost and related vehicle economy parameters

Please note that depending on the results of your vote the next economy update will be made based on the results of your choice, that’s why are publishing two separate table sheets of economy changes.

Open the table sheet with economy changes with economy based on the vehicle efficiency (See the 2nd tab 一 eff econ, norm (20/01))


Open the table sheet with economy changes with economy based on the vehicle rank. (See the 3rd tab 一 rank econ, norm (20/01))

The updated table sheet for changes

in reward multipliers, repair prices and related economy parameters of vehicles has been updated taking into account modifications and corrections described in this message.

Changes of the research cost, purchase cost and related parameters for some vehicles

[ Open the table sheet ]

Changes in the research trees

M1A1 Abrams and IPM1 一 switched places.


Pz.IV F2 and Pz.IV G 一 have been grouped.


Pz.IV H and Pz.IV J (in one group) 一 have been moved to rank II.


TAM and Begleitpanzer 57 一 switched places.


Crusader AA Mk.I and Crusader AA Mk.II 一 switched places.


Chi-Ha Kai and Ho-I 一 switched places.


Ikv 103 一 has been moved to rank III.


Ju 88 C-6 一 have been moved to rank II.


Bf 110 C-7 and Bf 110 F-2 一 have been grouped.


Tu-4, Tu-4 (China) 一 have been moved to rank V.


F-104G 一 has been moved to rank VII.

Revision of the bonus reward for victory and defeat

In the recent economy updates, we described the mechanics of earning Silver Lions and Research points, and proposed that you vote for one of the possible variants to change the bonus rewards at the end of a mission. This was followed by the second stage of voting in order to make the final decision with confidence. These are the results:

What RP reward distribution during a battle do you want to have in War Thunder?

56.7% 一 0.8 RP/sec for defeat and 1.2 RP/sec for victory


43.3% 一 0.6 RP/sec for defeat and 1.4 RP/sec for victory (same as before)

What SL reward distribution do you want to have in War Thunder?

66.1% 一 +20% for defeat and +47% for victory


33.9% 一 +0% зfor defeat and +67% for victory (same as before)

Thus, the bonus reward for defeat and victory in mission will be revised in accordance to the vote results. The changes will be deployed with an economic update, which we will announce later.

Discussion on switching to the new economy model

Currently, the game features an economy model with a calculation of economic parameters for mid- and high tier vehicles based on the efficiency statistic for each vehicle. Efficiency is the sum of Silver Lions earned without taking into account the reward multiplier, Premium account, boosters, achievements and mission bonuses for the given time, divided by the number of deaths on this vehicle for the same period of time. That is, the more active rewardable actions are performed by players (hits, critical damage, kill assists, destruction of enemies, points captures, damaging and destruction of enemy bases), and the less often they lose their vehicles, the higher the efficiency is. The system is used in the game for most of its existence due to the specifics of gameplay. We may balance the vehicles by changing their technical characteristics very rarely and through a very limited range as this may contravene historical data that we rely on when we create the vehicles. As a rule, we balance vehicles by the Battle Rating (BR), but we can only change it within certain ranges due to the features of the given vehicle. For example, the vehicles with modern ATGMs with high armour penetration value can’t be below a certain BR level, even when their efficiency is low. The same is true for the early heavy tanks with good armour protection that can not be set with too high a BR, due to a weak gun.

This inevitably leads to a situation where some of the vehicles find themselves in more preferable conditions, they are more comfortable to play and much more effective on their tier. While others can not equally rival with opponents and are far less fun to play. The current economy system (hereinafter, it will be referred to as the "vehicle efficiency economy") is built in such a way, that playing in a less effective vehicle is more profitable on average to avoid the “double punishment” - gameplay and economic - from the inefficient vehicle. At the same time, playing the more effective vehicles is more risky, and requires player skills to achieve a decent reward after deducting the repair costs.

However, with the growth of the vehicle number and the addition of new gaming nations, the uneven use of certain vehicles also grows. Some nations and vehicles are much more popular among players and this affects the efficiency statistics. Therefore, we are considering the option of introducing a new economic system, which will be completely based on the position of the vehicle in the research tree (rank and position at a rank relative to other vehicles). Further in the text, such an economy will be referred to as "the rank based economy". Such a system was originally used in the game for vehicles of initial ranks (currently these are ranks I and II, and also partially III and IV).

The potential transition to the rank based economy will also cause another noticeable change - the reduction of the maximum repair cost. Due to the constant growth of the number of high tier vehicles and the number of tiers themselves, the rank based economy requires revision of the repair costs and multipliers for all mid- and high-tier vehicles. Instead, we are planning to set these parameters on the almost fixed level for vehicles of ranks VI+ in order to minimize the following economic adjustments. In this case, the number of economy-equivalent vehicles will be quite big (all vehicles of ranks VI, VII, and following), and will be constantly growing. Keeping the current max repair costs level for such a number of vehicles would be wrong, so it requires a reduction.

Before comparing two economic approaches in numbers, it is necessary first to recall one of the features of the economy updates - the normalization of the economic parameters for vehicles. The normalization limits the maximum available change of economic parameters in every economy update in order to smooth the transition to the target values, as well as to avoid harsh changes for vehicles, whose efficiency may vary over time.
Thus, two tables are presented to compare the two economies:

with normalization of the values that allows a comparison of the two economies in the next economic update that is scheduled for February. Here you can also compare the parameters for a specific vehicle in the next economic update, depending on the economy used.


without normalization of values that allows the comparison of two economies at the target values that economic parameters would hypothetically reach for a significant number of economic updates for current vehicles at their current performance. We are not providing target values with details on specific vehicles, as these are hypothetical indicators that change with each subsequent upload of statistics.

In general it is needed to note the following pros and cons of each economy for players:

Vehicle efficiency economy:

(+) On average lossless play in less efficient vehicles of rank IV or higher without premium account.


(-) Vehicles of the less popular game nations are often the most efficient and as a result unprofitable.

Rank based economy:

(+) Repair cost and reward multipliers are identical for similar vehicles of different game nations.


(+) There is a clear correlation between economic parameters (repair cost, reward multipliers, reward for useful actions) and position in the research tree.


(-) Decrease in the demand for less efficient vehicles as they will become economically equivalent to more effective vehicles of the same rank which may also lead to the decrease in the variety of vehicles in the battles.

Generalized key differences between the rank based and vehicle efficiency economies can be summarized as follows:

greater reward multiplier for popular high ranked vehicles;


lower repair cost for unpopular medium-ranked vehicles;


higher repair cost for popular high ranked vehicles;


lower reward multiplier for unpopular medium-ranked vehicles.

Let us make some specific examples comparing the target indicators (not for the next economy update but for the final implementation for a hypothetically large number of economy updates at the current level of statistics) of the economy by the vehicle rank and the economy by the vehicle efficiency for vehicles discussed in the community:

base repair cost for T95 in AB will be 8360 SL instead of 17010 SL with a reward multiplier of 1.1 vs 1.3;


base repair cost for Strv 121 in RB will be 5350 SL instead of 7740 SL with a reward multiplier of 1.5 vs 1.6;


base repair cost for Tu-4 in RB will be 12570 SL instead of 30170 SL with a reward multiplier of 2.3 vs 1.8;


base repair cost for F-5A in RB will be 10210 SL instead of 5720 SL with a reward multiplier of 3.8 vs 2.9;


base repair cost for “Parizhskaya kommuna” in RB will be 28430 SL instead of 50860 SL with a reward multiplier of 2.0 vs 2.3.


base repair cost for F-86A-5 and CL-13 Mk.4 (Italy) in RB will be 11290 and 12410 SL instead of 6950 and 10490 SL respectively.

[ Vote ]

The table sheet for changes in reward multipliers, repair prices and related economy parameters of vehicles has been updated taking into account modifications and corrections described in this message.

Changes of the reward multipliers, repair cost and related vehicle economy parameters

Please note that depending on the results of your vote the next economy update will be made based on the results of your choice, that’s why are publishing two separate table sheets of economy changes.

Open the table sheet with economy changes with economy based on the vehicle efficiency (See the 2nd tab 一 eff econ, norm (20/01))


Open the table sheet with economy changes with economy based on the vehicle rank. (See the 3rd tab 一 rank econ, norm (20/01))

The updated table sheet for changes

in reward multipliers, repair prices and related economy parameters of vehicles has been updated taking into account modifications and corrections described in this message.

Changes of the research cost, purchase cost and related parameters for some vehicles

[ Open the table sheet ]

Changes in the research trees

M1A1 Abrams and IPM1 一 switched places.


Pz.IV F2 and Pz.IV G 一 have been grouped.


Pz.IV H and Pz.IV J (in one group) 一 have been moved to rank II.


TAM and Begleitpanzer 57 一 switched places.


Crusader AA Mk.I and Crusader AA Mk.II 一 switched places.


Chi-Ha Kai and Ho-I 一 switched places.


Ikv 103 一 has been moved to rank III.


Ju 88 C-6 一 have been moved to rank II.


Bf 110 C-7 and Bf 110 F-2 一 have been grouped.


Tu-4, Tu-4 (China) 一 have been moved to rank V.


F-104G 一 has been moved to rank VII.

German

There was a time to vote on it.

As above.

Just checked. Works fine. Are you sure you are logged in on page? Without it, it will not works for you.

There was time to convince other Players for Your opinion. Now it's too late, sorry.

As above. Guys, there was time to discuss it and convince other Players for Your opinion. You see the poll results on that.

Now we have new poll, focused on way we should calculate vehicles economy.

You (Players) selected that option.

Explain please. Right now your feedback is useless

Rank requirement will be decreased by 1, yes.

Already explained weeks ago, when we published previous polls. Poll was on balance, not on adding more and more.

Well, that's what majority of you selected.

Please try again, maybe with punctuation marks. Right now, I have no clue what you want to say, sorry.

Already explained numerous times.

Already explained. Balance changes was not on giving more and more SL to the poll. You need to take from somewhere, to put it somewhere else.

In the rank based economy, the efficiency of vehicles will not be taken into account in any way.

The reward multiplier and the cost of repairing vehicles bring the earnings and spending of vehicles to the desired level. Now the desired level is determined based on the vehicle efficiency, but in the new economy it will be determined based on the vehicle rank and its position within the rank.
That is, we will still make economic changes that will bring income and spending to the desired level, but this level will be the same for the same units.

Because world is not an Utopia.

Check tables.

Dunno how many times we need to repeat it, but longer you play/stay in battle being active - more you earn.

Yes, it's always like that. There are always a few, who didn't knew on something. Discount, event, vote, (put something here). Well, in XXI century we all are overwhelmed with information and not always are able to get all we want.

The frequency of economic changes does not depend on the economic system. But in the rank based economy, the target values o econ parameters will be achieved faster, taking into account normalization.

Still, there should be no big differences.

Mate, I have no clue what you have to poles (or even better, Poles), but better leave them alone. (both, poles, and Poles)

Players already decided.

Please stop with that random riddles.

Please edit your post to state that they are understandable.

Firstly, the repair cost may not change when new vehicles are added - this will depend on whether the position of future vehicles was taken into account when setting the position of this vehicle (vehicles at each rank have an internal gradation even if there is only one of them now - that is, they still defined as the vehicle of the beginning of a rank, its middle or top).
But the cost can change for other reasons - first of all, when the lifetime of vehicle changes, since it links earnings (which is set per unit of time) with the repair cost (which is paid not per unit of time, but upon death or flyout). But the lifetime for most of the units varies little over time.

Unit position on the rank (beginning, medium, top) affects the research cost, purchase cost and other same parameters - you can see that the vehicles on the rank differ in these. And you can trace some patterns in the position of vehicles at the rank, even if there is only one of them.

Ground RB. It's hard for me to go lower than 75% activity, usually I am way above 80%. I play till the end (I use all my vehicles).

Maybe it's because I play aggressive? Dunno, but I will stand with my opinion, that playing longer is better both for SL and RP.

Why? As long as we have got good and constructive discussion, it's really nice

German M48 is in normalization, and its target repair cost is similar to American tank. It's related to all vehicles which repair cost are currently normalized.

I do not understand. Why such thing is needed in your opinion? What will it change if you will see you got 69% (he he) activity? You will try harder (damn, that jokes)? Well, you should try harder all the time.

But it is! Better you play - more SL/RP you will get. I though it's obvious.

The hint is in the title )

Should be more or less same time. We will simply check the votes and goes with one option.

Well, there is no game that will please everyone

Because it will be a process that will take few steps. We cannot change the price in one step, that would be too drastic in both ways.

well, ok then

That topic is on rank based economy.

You got 1 vote and you can try to convince other players to vote same as you voted.

Out of nowhere, random question on MM.

And on topic. "Lets play for a while" - thing is, now it's the time to decide. Be sure to check the topic and vote on option that fits you best.

Oh, there is more of them, BR/MM posts.

Please stop.

Oh mate, you are aware that there is no super secret plot against people who launch booster? I understand that it's tempting to believe in some higher powers, but not here, sorry. At the end of the day it's just you and your team skill what counts.

Already answered. It will take few steps to normalize repair prices.

They are not identical. There will be not significant difference.

You are right, it's crazy.

Yes.

As I said, after all the changes (not only 1st step), price will be almost same.

SB reward multiplier doesn't affect earnings in air SB because the reward is calculated from the "reward for useful actions". Repairs in Air SB and Air RB are difficult to compare, because the life time varies greatly in these modes, and the repair cost is highly dependent on this indicator.

As has been previously explained, the initial changes bring things closer into line within a rank. It will take an additional future pass(es) to bring things even closer into line. This update alone that is proposed would already change a significant amount.

February is 1st step.

What do you mean by "you really want us to trust that the result of the vote was this"? You want to say we just made it up? What next? All voices on forum different than yours are made up? Please take your strange point of view on world and leave it outside our forum.

You are late for the party. That was voted weeks ago.

You are late for the party. That was voted weeks ago.

Monday morning.

Such options would tell us nothing at all really. "I don't care" is about as useful as not voting at all.

We have the voting open and also this topic for players to leave their more detailed thoughts

Disagreement with either system is entirely fine. But a voting option of "none of the above" is of no use as we have to have an economical system for the game and these are the only 2 viable options currently, with the new system taking a considerable amount of planning.

If you don't like either, that's what this topic is for, to discuss why and give your thoughts and suggestions. But for the purpose of actually identifying which of these two systems is most preferred a "none of the above" option is meaningless and tells us nothing.

Whatever one has the majority vote will be published at the conclusion of the voting process with the deployment of the update.

The Chinese F-104G is already rank VII, the Italian one also would be, except Italy does not have Rank VII.

Missiles are more closely linked with BR over Rank. Currently, its BR is not planned to change. New missiles would mean a new BR.

During whole weekend.

"Planned economy changes in February"

Thank you for all your feedback and votes!

Text updated with new table + info on changes in research tech tree. (marked with blue font)

More info on topic:

Thank you for all your feedback and votes!

Original text update with new table + info on changes in tech tree (blue font).

Answering your questions and comments.