Original Post — Direct link

Hey folx,

Thank you all for contributing feedback to Temtem. Since the closure of the official forums, this subreddit has been the primary target for giving feedback, but there has been some confusion or unfamiliarity on how feedback should be provided.

In this post, we from the moderation team aim to shed light into this, and how the feedback should be constructed, so that the developers from Crema can quickly read through useful input and the climate on the subreddit improves.

  • I have an idea or criticism for the game. Where do I post it?

Great! Please check if your topic has already been discussed in the last 14 days. If yes, formulate your feedback into this topic as a top-level comment and upvote the thread. Upvoting helps to make that thread more visible, meaning it's more likely to be seen by the developers. If such a thread does not exist, feel free to make your own.

  • How should my feedback be constructed?

There is a lot of "I don't like this" on certain topics, but not enough helpful posts that will help to move Crema in the right direction. Feedback is super appreciated when it shares specific actions that Crema could take, or proposes changes that don't stray far from the idea of the game.

Example of helpful feedback:

In a small paragraph, it's becoming immediately clear what the issue is and why it's causing problems, all while being easy and quick to read.

Example of unhelpful feedback:

Not well constructed, starts with helpful input but then derailing with a different topic.

Keep your feedback concise, clear and state shortly how things could be improved. The faster the devs can read through it, the more time they'll have to read other suggestions. Do not attempt to throw shade, don't include backhanded comments or post feedback with the intent of gaslighting. Such posts may be removed without comment at a moderator's discretion.

Only post feedback if you actually want the game to improve, and keep in mind devs reserve the last right to include feedback. While they might not reply to posts, as they're often abundant, they read through it all.

  • A note on the battle camera feature

Since it's inception, the subreddit's discussions have been dominated by the battle cam. There's been a lot of feedback during that time, both helpful and unhelpful. Please note that Crema is aware that some people are not happy about the feature or have issues playing the game. That said, Crema is still open to receive further feedback about this subject, as long as the feedback is well-constructed and elaborates on key points, such as pin-pointing the reason for the issues and how it could be improved.

Posting "add a toggle" under every post is spam and going forward, we will treat it as such. Avoid repetitive behaviour and do not write posts about things that have been said already a dozen of times. "The more people complain, the sooner something is done", is a popular concept for online games, but it does not work here and it's not helpful for Crema. With these changes, we aim to make the subreddit a healthier and friendlier experience for all users that come to visit.

Thank you everyone and stay excellent.

Your TemMod-Team.

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over 1 year ago - /u/ItsTsukki - Direct link

Originally posted by AndyMazaky

Thanks, I would appreciate it if you could confirm since on the day that I made the post YaW replied in another thread but since I didn't get any reply on mine (at least nodding that they read/will read the thread) I was not sure if the devs were aware of it or the long format was the problem.

Hey friend! We don't reply on all posts because we don't always have time to do so, or anything "useful" to say, but we read it too and we're aware of all posts. Depending on the time we have available that day we'll read it completely or quickly scan over it, not going to lie, so formatting and organizing it in a way that the most important points are clear is a good thing.
We've historically had issues with feedback posts only being considered addressed when they received a reply, but we can't always keep that up so we try to let people know that we don't reply all the time, but we read it. The thing with the feedback implemented is that it never happens right away, and usually doesn't happen the exact way the players suggested, so saying "oh yeah we'll do this" under a post is a rare (albeit wonderful) experience.

over 1 year ago - /u/ItsTsukki - Direct link

Originally posted by AndyMazaky

Thanks for responding Tsukki, I know how difficulty could it be to respond but since most of times feedback can take a while to be implemented, if it gets implemented, I think that addressing, even if it was "Feedback has been read, we can't reply in details now but it will be discussed with the Team!" can be helpful enough so that the community can feel that their feedback is at least being helpful to the game and being forwarded to the people responsible in that regard.

No probs! I'd love to get your opinion on the two issues/challenges I see to this.

One, I'm not in charge of design, so me reading something doesn't necessarily mean it's reached the right ears. If I, the one who can probable see most of the feedback posts, read it, but no one on the design team does, it's fallen on the wrong hands. I can forward all of them to the design team but there's no guarantee they'll have the time to read it all. I'm afraid we might be giving the community false hope.

Two, don't you think that if we acknowledge all the feedback there'll be a growing expectation that can transform into bitterness when said feedback takes too long to be implemented, or never gets implemented? Managing expectations around feedback has proven to be one of the most difficult bits around here.

What do you think, how would you work around those two things?

over 1 year ago - /u/ItsTsukki - Direct link

Originally posted by SeRialPiXel

The following one is a genuine question, not trying to catch anyone in a "gotcha!" so if any of the devs could reply it would go a long way.

I think it was an AMA with an Apex Legends developer and he talked about feedback. He said that feedback should be something a player expresses like their "feeling towards x or y", then it's the developers' job to find the best solutions to address it. Because of that I just took that as a rule and in general in games when giving feedback I only communicate my feelings towards things (positive as well! For example I really enjoyed S2 PVP-wise and said so on discord) because I'm not qualified enough to offer the right solutions. It's not the case for this team?

Hello! I know many devs have that attitude towards feedback, and even in Crema, there's peeps who think like that too, but in this particular case and platform we were also hoping to get more insight on feedback that we might not understand where it's coming from (like in the case of the battle camera, as people who don't suffer from dizziness, or in the case of colorblind improvements). We were also hoping to stray a bit from feedback that's just an emotional feeling. Since there's many different players in Temtem, we want to know more about their needs and expectations, beyond only their feelings towards a thing.

We usually draw the line at people explaining how to code something, or why something is easy or hard to do. That's where we consider we're more qualified to make a decision, but knowing the hoped-for outcome people have in mind generally helps and doesn't harm the process.

over 1 year ago - /u/ItsTsukki - Direct link

Originally posted by AndyMazaky

I think that is different in terms of "hoping and dreaming" if we are talking about artwork and when we are talking about technical feedback, the reality is that if a feedback was already decided internally as a "no" and no matter how much the community discuss that thing will never get touched then is better for them to just say it instead of community waiting for months to years without a word about the subject, since it directly correlated to the players overall experience of the game, while artwork is also part of player overall experience, will not impact directly the fundamental mechanics of the game.

For example the so much discussed Player Cam Toggle, it's something that direct affect player experience, they have acknowledged it but still don't communicate enough with the community and since there is no clear answer people will keep insisting since some people can't even play the game at all because of it.

And like I talked a little I don't think people expect a prompt reply from the team, but for the size of Crema I think that they can spare some time to answer players feedback and put the community in peace of mind for some subjects, also 30+ people while still small is not "very small" anymore from my perspective, DRG is smaller/same size than Crema and have constant contact with the community about feedback and discussion in general.

Hmm I think flat-out saying we haven't said a word on the subject is unfair, and the kind of argument that only cause damage and disconnection from the community. We've (I've) said in multiple occasions that the team is aware and considering the need, but until a decision has been made and it's ready to be publicly shared, we cannot give a yes or a no. When I asked you before, you said our reply should be more balanced towards doing it in the future or not doing it, but at the time of gathering the feedback no one can tell me that. That comes much later, that internal definition.

DRG has an open development-type of approach, and we had that too during Early Access, but like we've said in the past, the current stage is a bit different. I stay in contact with the community daily, but I don't have feedback approval or public news daily. I liked your idea of setting aside a couple hours, but even if the design team says yes, the coding team and art team have to say yes too, and it ends up escalating the amount of time it'd consume. I cannot promise anything of this sort will happen because it's not my time alone.

over 1 year ago - /u/ItsTsukki - Direct link

Originally posted by AndyMazaky

I will try to address both challenges in my way of thinking, of course I don't know how internally the company works so I will not have assumptions and just to think the most simple way about it:

I think that the first problem would be a little more troublesome to address, but at same time I think that you forwarding to the team is already the right direction and maybe the solution would be a compromise from the whole team, and the company, of a couple hours per week to read said feedback forwarded by you and give their thoughts/opinions on the matter back, so someone (I don't know if could also be you) could make a compilation and come back with the feedback that the team provided.

Thus It would also address the second point, like Lyefyre already talked, knowing what feedback was take, be it in "We will look towards it and try to implement in the future" or "This is not be possible because of X or Y" without being something that is defined only internally and the community keeps without the knowledge about the subject.

I would also point out that the way that this compile of feedback from the team to the community about our own feedback could be provided is throughout something that I suggested on my thread a while back, the Devblogs made on Steam that could be shared on Reddit and on Discord, I already talked a little with TMT about it and I know that roadmaps made a lot of stress but at least knowing what the team is working, what is planned for the future, what feedback is being take and implemented in the game, working in progress artworks, etc, even without dates, would already make the community regain a lot of trust in the team and feel like they are being heard and have something to look forward to in the future.

Hi! Sorry about the delay, got busier. I like the first idea, but as I said in some other post, it's not my time alone to compromise so I can't say if it'll happen. Feedback ends up having to go through many teams to see if it's doable.

As for devlogs, I really like the idea, but I know in practice some of them would be very boring, like "we're still developing the 3rd Mythical, we're still working on a secret feature that we want to keep a secret from you until release". The old roadmaps still work in terms of features, and with Seasons there's a lot more info on dates, themes, and all that. I'm also, personally, worried about spoiling too much about upcoming features before the right time. I've seen it happen and didn't like the result.
But the one, true, actual issue I see with this is that I fear the community won't feel heard unless their feedback has been implemented, not acknowledged or discarded.