Path of Exile

Path of Exile Dev Tracker




05 Mar

Comment

Originally posted by taggedjc

What about modifiers just to life recovery rate, rather than modifiers to "leech recovery rate"? Are those applied after the leech rate is determined, before applying to the actual life recovered?

Such that if you also had "50% increased life recovery rate" in your first example, you'd gain 60 life per second for those 7.5 seconds, instead of 40 life per second? And in the second case, instead of gaining 230 life per second in total, you'd gain 345 life per second in total?

So to follow on from the example, let's say you also have 10% of Life Regenerated per second, so 100 life per second from regen.

Total recovery is therefore 330 (230 leech + 100 regen), and that number is increased by generic modifiers to life recovery rate.

This is not ideal (recovery rate modifier gets applied separately to more specific things, and thus ends up multiplicative), but before now there were things that prevented changing that, and now we can't change it without adjusting all the stuff that's balanced around how it currently works, so that's not going to change for a while.

EDIT: fixed typo on the regen number

Comment

Originally posted by ACTPOHABT

I am glad all my work was rewarded with an honest answer, thank you for clarifying the reasoning behind the current mechanics : ) I it wouldn't be too much to ask for actual numbers of the way adjacent maps are weighted ?

Thanks to KarvarouskuGaming for making the post and helping me with ideas of how to setup the tests. I might have not attempted to do it without his feedback.

As you have more-or-less shown, there is a 2x weighting for incomplete maps, and 4x weighting for adjacent maps, multiplicative.

Comment

Originally posted by welpxD

How does the new "10% max life per leech instance" limit interact with the stat "increased life leeched per second"? Does Slayer's "100% increased life leeched per second" increase the total amount of leech from each instance, or does it shorten the instances?

The maximum amount of recovery is applied to each leech instance. The modifier you're referring to does not apply to the individual instances, but to the total value of recovery you're getting from all instances combined. It has been reorded to make this clearer because this distinction is important - that stat is now described as "x% increased total Recovery per second from Life Leech".

As an example showing all the relevant modifiers, assume you have these stats:

  • 1000 Maximum Life
  • 50% increased Maximum Recovery per Life Leech
  • 100% increased total Recovery per second from Life Leech
  • 15% increased Maximum total Recovery per second from Life Leech
  • 30% of Physical Attack Damage Leeched as Life

From these, we can derive the following extra stats:

  • Your Life Leech Recovery Rate is 20 Life per sec...
Read more
Comment

So, adjacent maps have been weighted higher than non-adjacent maps (where applicable) ever since the Atlas was introduced back in 2.4.0, to make it easier to explore the Atlas where you want. The empirical evidence here appears to be roughly what's expected.

Sorry if there any accidental misinformation a few leagues ago. It was probably assumed that, since you were asking in relation to a change to complete vs. incomplete map drop weightings, that adjacency was not part of that equation (the numbers in that last question would be correct if all maps were adjacent).

Comment

Originally posted by skkrrtskkrrt

Is the wording on Ghost reaver going to be changed? Since it's the same as zealot's oath and "life regeneration per endurance charge" node scales with ES but the wording says maxmium life.

Is the wording on Ghost reaver going to be changed?

Yes.

Comment

Originally posted by Having-a-hard-time

Resistance displayed as ∞ would look even cooler.

Just saying.

While true, I suspect we're eventually going to have to change to not modifying the resistance display int he character panel when you become immune. It's only a matter of time until there's some effect that scales based on the actual value (or uncapped value) of your chaos resistance, and thus means it's important to be able to see that value - or likewise an immunity to one of the elemental damage types, since those already have things that scale on resistance.

Ideally, in such a situation resistance would not be displayed while immune (there would instead be a specific line saying you're immune), unless you also had some other stat that scaled on resistance and made it display the resistance values so you could see them (alongside the immunity).

Comment

Originally posted by wooser69

Mark I have a question. Life/mana leech is currently capped to recovering 2%/s per instance of leech by default. Is this the case for ES leech as well, or is it 1%/s to fit with the 10%/s maximum?

You are incorrect. Leech instances are not capped to 2% recovery per second - they are always at that rate. A cap would mean they can be at lower rates, which is not the case.

The 2% value is the same for ES as for life and mana. This means that it takes fewer leech instances to reach maximum recovery per second (5 instances of ES leech, compared to 10 for life/mana).

Comment

Originally posted by Rumstein

Ascendant* Slayer reduces it by 50%, right?

whoops, fixed

Comment

CI makes you immune to chaos damage. That is not at all the same thing as setting your chaos resistance to 100%.

It will continue to do exactly what it does now, which is make you actually immune to chaos damage.

While you are immune to a damage type, your resistance is displayed as 100% because that looks cool, but that's entirely visual thing, not anything to do with how immunity applies.

Comment

You are misunderstanding what is being said. The 10% limit here is the same for all leech types, and is an entirely different thing than the maximum total recovery per second from leech (which is 20% of max base for life and mana, and 10% for ES).

This is a separate maximum on the amount of recovery a single instance of leech can grant. This maximum is 10% of the maximum of that resource (life/mana/es) as the base value, and Ascendant Slayer reduces it by 50%, resulting in 5% of the resource maximum.

Comment

Originally posted by Nickoladze

Thanks for making my belt stronger, Mark! We couldn't convert life leech instances into ES leech instances at the time it was made which was a pretty big disappointment.

Glad you like it! I was really happy when I came up with this solution to keep the belt working under the new system, and work for hybrid builds while only needing life leech modifiers (not also having to get ES leech ones).

It also has the side effect of making it much weaker with CI (because you're still doing life leech, both the maximum total leech rate, and the new maximum amount per leech are still based on your max life, which is 1), but it should work more smoothly with hybrid builds, which is the main point as I understand it.

Comment

Originally posted by SirClueless

The unique Soul Tether has a different mechanic, which is also changed. It lets you leech life, but while you're on full life, your life leech effects are not removed from you, and those life leech effects will recover energy shield rather than life. They are still life leech effects, not ES leech, and thus are scaled based on life, and affected by life leech modfiiers, not ES leech modifiers.

Whaaaaaat?!

Some questions:

  1. Can you now gain life leech instances while at full life by hitting an enemy while wearing Soul Tether?
  2. Are life leech instances removed when you reach full ES?

Assuming 1. is yes and 2. is no, it sounds like you can get pseudo-Slayer/Ascendant Slayer leech by wearing Soul Tether and having a sizeable ES pool.

But even if not you can get a huge benefit now out of ES on any leech-based character by equipping Soul Tether. This is a huge change in my eyes, and it's what I...

Read more

Can you now gain life leech instances while at full life by hitting an enemy while wearing Soul Tether?

Yes -that's part of the effect of not removing them at full life. Besides, otherwise the item wouldn't work.

Are life leech instances removed when you reach full ES?

No, life leech effects are only ever removed at full life. If this does become a balance issue, we could change Soul Tether to remove them at full ES instead, but to my knowledge this hasn't happened yet.

Comment

Originally posted by dethan90

They are still life leech effects, not ES leech, and thus are scaled based on life, and affected by life leech modfiiers, not ES leech modifiers.

In 3.6, with an equipped Soul Tether on full life and using Bloodseeker (with it's instant life leech modifiers) will those modifiers apply to my ES ? Or is that unique mod not considered a "life leech modifier" in this context ?

You will leech life instantly, and recover ES instead from that instant leech when life is full. It will still be isntant.

Also, in contrast to the current mechanics, a single instance of life leech can bring you to full life and then apply the remainder of it's effect to ES (regardless of whether you make it instant or not), because it's only changing where the recovery goes, not anything about what the leech is.

In the previous version the excess from that leech was wasted, and when you next caused leech, because you were now on full life, the new leech was modified to apply to ES (because that was something that needed to be determined when the leech occured and couldn't change).

Comment

Previously, PoE had no ES leech, but Ghost Reaver applied life leech to ES (in a specific way). That is no longer the case.

In 3.6.0, ES leech exists distinct from life leech, and is it's own thing. Ghost Reaver now works by making any effect that would give you life leech give you ES leech instead. Because this is ES Leech and not Life Leech, no modifiers that apply to Life Leech will affect it. Only modifiers to ES leech will affect it.

Vaal Pact only affects life leech, and thus has no interaction with ES leech.

The unique Soul Tether has a different mechanic, which is also changed. It lets you leech life, but while you're on full life, your life leech effects are not removed from you, and those life leech effects will recover energy shield rather than life. They are still life leech effects, not ES leech, and thus are scaled based on life, and affected by life leech modfiiers, not ES leech modifiers. This is so that item can continue to fulfill it's role...

Read more
Comment

Originally posted by Blakaraz

Are you sure about the fact that increased recovery rate for life does not multiply the max amount of life you get from leech per second? Eg. 50% increased life recovery rate resulting in 30% life per second recovered from leech, if you have the unmodified 20% cap?

Or am I misunderstanding you, and thats not what you are saying (I assume that "increasing recovery per second" refers to life/es recovery rate mods)?

Are you sure about the fact that increased recovery rate for life does not multiply the max amount of life you get from leech per second? Eg. 50% increased life recovery rate resulting in 30% life per second recovered from leech, if you have the unmodified 20% cap?

Yes. The whole point of that stat is it's a maximum, increasing the value of the thing it's a maximum for doesn't increase the maximum.

It has worked this way since it was introduced, and the wiki page explains this interaction (see here). Your total (the wiki say...

Read more
Comment

Originally posted by ErrorLoadingNameFile

Actually modern dots can leech.

This is not true. Leech is a hit mechanic, and that has not changed.

Comment

Originally posted by Dantonn

Maximum total Recovery per second from ES Leech

Is this a hard cap on recovery from ES Leech or would modifiers to ES recovery (or recovery rate) still be able to increase it further?

This is a hard limit on the total recovery rate from all instances of Energy Shield leech affecting you. Increasing recovery per second does not let you bypass this cap, it just lets you reach it easier/with fewer leech instances.

This is not a change (other than ES leech existing and thus having it's own max); existing life/mana leech maximums already work this way, and have done since they were introduced.

Comment

Originally posted by welpxD

It increases the leech cap for ES, yes. For some reason they can't use the same wording they do for life leech.

This is the same wording as the life version - that wording had to be adapted because of the changes to the leech system (primarily the introduction of another maximum which needs to be clearly distinguished from this one, but also some other suff).

However, as I noted in my othert comment, this won't look like this on realease - all such modifiers on the tree and items will be instead done as a % increase (or reduction) to the base amount of this leech maximum, so they won't have to say anything about max ES/Life/Mana in their description.

We also improved how the character panel displays this stuff.