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You are right, we are making one of our success measures on reducing memory leaks, not only in champ select, where we will start, but all over the client.
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You are right, we are making one of our success measures on reducing memory leaks, not only in champ select, where we will start, but all over the client.
u/Am1t8 It would be awesome if the folks working on this could share their findings on riot's tech blog. As a dev that has followed your blog since the firsts articles on the new client, I'd be eager to read about it
This is something I am considering, would live to share the technical details behind our work.
u/Am1t8 Anything you can say about the Match Accepted bug? This is the biggest prblem for me. its literally game breaking. ...lets say elo breaking
Can you direct message me the exact issue (report steps if possible), I can have the team look into it, thanks!
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I will have the team look into this, definitely an annoying bug.
I wish i knew wtf they did to post game though, where it used to be quick and now takes ages to get out of the game.
This is something we plan to tackle in the coming months! stay tuned!
At this point the only two things that bother me about the client are the long stalls at the end of each game, and the notifications from gifts sticking around every single time I open the client. I've gifted myself a ton of mystery skins from a second account and every single notification from every skin I've gifted myself keeps showing up in the top right every time I open the client, two at a time. It's a minor inconvenience but holy f**k is it annoying having to click through dozens of notifications every time I open the game.
Thanks for the feedback, and yes, while working on champ select, we will also be working on making improvements to the end of game experience
Great example of busyness rather than work. How much time of "work" did it take to survey and graph the obvious thing to work on, rather than working on it immediately because it was a no-brainer.
Fair question;
We had to start the year cleaning up our plugin architecture before we can unlock performance improvements within the client (we still are working on the architecture cleanup). We wanted to pick a KPI (improve client bootstrap time for a majority of our players globally) so we can track our success to players.
The survey was an independent exercise we ran to understand the biggest pain points around the client globally. Some regions actually wanted to see an improvement in bootstrap time, while others had more frustration around champ select and end of game. Using this data, we can make decisions on what we want to work on that will improve client performance and reliability for all our players globally. To measure our success, we want to see the frustration trend downwards, and now we have data that tells us if we make improvements to champ select and end of game, we should see a positive trend.
Although our re-architecture work is n...
Read moreRead moreI have some thoughts and recommendations for the champ select experience (as one who used to play on an ultrabook and now plays on a full on desktop with dedicated graphics card):
Remove all of the current animations. Literally all of them. I know that it looks "cool" for things to smoothly transition and look alive, but the animations on champ select serve a significantly lesser purpose (and, quite frankly, are less important) than overall smooth champ select. I did not know that the rune screen has animations on the right hand side (the pool of water). I would rather have simple checkboxes instead of a pretty screen that freezes the screens of my teammates and causes lobbies to dodge because buttons are frozen.
Consider introducing animations for the champ select process that serve a purpose. Right now, we have animations that are either too subtle to be seen and/or are used for t...
Yes! love this post, because it is very similar to the approach we are taking with our UX discovery. For your points 1 & 2 , we (League Client Team) are identifying which animations are potential bottlenecks to performance, and we are working on collecting that data. On the other hand, your point #2, we are working in partnership with our champ select design team to understand what animations are most important to players and make sure if we have them, they do not cause reliability or performance issues. Right now, I can't say we can remove all animations, until we understand which ones are performance degrading and measure them against the value they provide our players.
For point three, I will need to work with the team to identify how and when we can look into low-spec mode.
Love the feedback!
at the current pace maybe we'll have a half decent client in 5 years. ty dedicated client team
Our goal is to deliver results quicker than that!
So they've been posting about the client cleanup for a while but all they've done to fix the most annoying problem this client has are some surveys? lol they do know how to spend their time. No wonder why they later go cry at Twitter that people call them incompetent.
Appreciate the comment!
We wanted to take a different approach with this post. From feedback received in previous posts, players weren't that interested in a chart showing our re-architecture work (even though internally it's very important for us).
during our most recent milestone, we got a lot of architecture work done, addressed around 60 bugs, and improved our startup times for players around the world that have slower machines, and we got really close to our goal.
The purpose of the survey is that we wanted to get a global view of what the players wanted us to work on, we used that data, and now are going to work on two of the more critical parts of the game loop, which is champ select & end of game. Given these are very frustrating for players when they encounter problems, we plan to deliver changes to make both experiences more reliable over the next couple months.
Thank you
Thanks for bringing this up! One of our plugins had an outage recently, and it looks like the logging for that is a bit too much. We are working with the team to limit the size of the log files, we do not want log files this large!
The team is aware of broader issues impacting several of our games and services (e.g. our chat service spans across multiple products), they are looking into it!
I have to think that the biggest source of frustration are bugs in pick/ban which ultimately lead to undesired dodges from the players.
I'm really curious if there's a primary culprit to all these types of bugs. Is it failures from microservices? Is it database getting overloaded? Is it that the app's state is getting out of wack at times and so the client gets into a state which it shouldn't really be able to get into?
Thanks for this, and you are right, looking at our global survey results, champ select pick/ban issues seems to be very frustrating with players, and we are starting our discovery on what we can do to make this better.
Appreciate the feedback and update, I can tell you we are working our hardest to improve the client for all of our players;
- We have a really complex architecture that we are working hard to clean up, and doing this will unlock opportunities to improve the player experience in the client, which we will provide an update on in our next dev. post at the end of the month or early September given our recent company-wide break. Our team's goal in this next post is to give you insight into what players want to see addressed in the client, and how we are going to tackle them, and provide player-facing KPIs to track progress & success.
- We are listening to you, our players! we are actively collecting information from players via a sentiment survey (you may have got it!), on things players are frustrated with the most in the client. We have got great information so far and we are going to use that to prioritize what we work on next.
-As we clean up the architecture...
Read moreThanks for the feedback,
As mentioned below, we took out a number of plugins on client startup until they are clicked by the player.
We did have discussions and made sure any plugin we decided to defer on startup would load within 3 seconds for 90% of our players. We also wanted to acknowledge the user action of a click by introducing that loading widget.
Why did we do this? -- We want to improve the client start-up times for a majority of our players and we were able to achieve this by fixing our deferred loading technology. Think of it this way, If you were to visit a site, it will not load all the hyperlinks that are on the front page, they would load when clicked. With our architecture work, we intend to clean up not only the plugin architecture but have the technology that runs the client work the way it is intended to work.
Read morefor store it takes 3 minuts and the animation is just scracth my brain. [even the colours of it feels stupi...
Is creating a new client from scratch a solution ? Using an in game engine like Valorant or LoR seems to work way better. I know this games are brand new and benefits from better code architecture, but it feels like a client using ingame engine would be really better. Allow observing 3d model in the shop (a la Wild Rift) and having maybe better performances ?
I'm sure there is a reason you keep up with this spaghetti client but it feels weird from a customer pov ! ^
We are working hard to untangle this spaghetti to unlock improvements across all parts of the client :)
This kind of reply is a meme at this point. Very little gets done over YEARS and then an embarrassing Reddit post shows up and suddenly rioters start to rush and talk about how they are about to fix them soon.
Yeah, this is true, I have just recently joined this team and super excited about the work ahead, and my goal is to use player feedback and data to help us get the client to a better place. I hope to change this perception, but it won't happen overnight.
Thanks for the comment.
A bit of feedback regarding that, I think comms may need to be simplified regarding progress and what not. Based on comments in the past client updates, not many people understood what were the significance of reducing emberapps or what bootstrap is, they want something very simple without technical jargon (ie Client is finally fixed or whatever)
Yes! love this comment, we definitely want to be more clear on how our architecture work (reducing plugins + ember apps) directly relates to the player impact, and we hope to articulate this on the next dev. post (although I do not have an answer/date to 'the client is finally fixed'.we have a lot left to complete and we acknowledge that)
Thanks
Is there a tracker or something that shows what’s being tackled?
Good question, very early results from our survey is that players want to know what we are doing more frequently, so a valid call out!
We have started adding our significant changes and bug fixes in the patch notes, but I am working with the team to see if there is anything else we can do to increase our communication with our community (on top of the dev. posts + patch notes)
Thanks!
I deeply hope that someday, these issues will be tackled. I hope that bugs will be fixed, instead of being left there for us to get used to them, for us to get used to a worse client.
This statement resonates a lot with me... we want to address as many of the bugs listed as we can. We are encouraged by our continued architecture work (as highlighted in our dev. blog post) that will help us remove these bugs, and if they do arise, allow the team to address them quickly.
Side note, we have launched a player sentiment survey around the client across various regions (random selection, some players may have got it already!), to capture the client pain points, and use this information to tackle the biggest issues for our players with regards to the client! Expect to hear more in our upcoming dev. post!
Thank you for the thorough post, this takes a lot of time and we appreciate it! We are reading this!