is it really a fighter item? cause it seems the main champions that built wits end were all Ranged and melee adcs (and irelia but she is basicly a melee adc like yasuo/yone now)
Stat line (edit: for Maw) seems like exactly what Pantheon or Fiora or Camille would like. Don't see why it's not a fighter item.
could objective bounties have something to do with it? Longer games means happier vaynes
That’s a decent idea. Late game champions are almost certainly buffed when there suddenly exists new comeback mechanics.
"They" wtf you can just go on Slack and ask them to consider that ??
I can. But there’s only so much I’m willing to spam them. They’re certainly aware that Maw isn’t good. But fighters are currently fine and probably don’t need a buff vs. mages at the moment.
I guess the question is Wits a resistance item or an offensive item. We run into trouble when things are good in multiple roles. I'd argue maybe slight increase in offensive stats and an increased MR cut would more clearly define the item.
It’s a fighter item. Fighter items are cool in that they go for damage and durability on one axis at a time. I think their itemization is compelling.
But isn't there a difference between a fed Ekko using his entire combo to kill someone, and GP landing one barrel? I remember back in the day, a GP landing a crit barrel meant that you had to recall or lifesteal back up, not literally get obliterated. Sure, Saber could have built Shieldbow, so that's on him, but the whole reason Shieldbow is so needed in the first place is because a gust of wind kills you nowadays. Is it really right that Lux oneshot him with just Q and E? A few seasons ago, she would have needed to invest her ult, or at least an auto attack.
To be fair Gangplank landing a barrel is literally every offensive cooldown he has save ultimate. And I’m most cases it’s 2-3 charges of E and winning the barrel timing vs. his opponents.
Citation needed for Lux. If you think damage has gone up then prove it. Which items did Lux buy and where are her bases and ratios compared to [pick a year]? That’s kinda the beauty of these arguments: you can irrefutably prove how damage output has changed and you have all the available data.
As I said earlier, I’ve done this for support and it’s been downward. IDK where it’s gone for other roles but you can look it up.
I honestly do not understand the distaste for Maw, it is 109% gold efficient with base stats alone (for comaprison right now wits end pre nerf is 106% gold efficient) it has good stats and a decent build path with Hexdrinker and a couple of daggers into a Warhammer.
The only serious complain you could have is it shares the lifeline passive of shieldbow and sterak, but besides that it's a great item on its own.
Even the build that might not seem much after getting the hexdrinker, it needs only another 1500g and gives you +25 MR, +30 AD, +15 AH, which is 1900g of stats alone and empowers the passive.
I'm not saying it's better then Wit's End which has better synergy with on-hit builds and gives more dps due to AS component, but it's far better then people seem to think
Basically it appears to be strictly inferior to its two replacements:
Wit's is a better dueling item than Maw and though it gives less burst survivability (200 + 20% max health shield on an item with no health), gives far more damage for winning that duel in the first place.
Sterak's Gage gives a similar amount of baseline durability and damage (50 AD, 500 hp vs. 50 MR), the shields are of similar size (100+8-40% max hp vs. 200+20% max hp), but Sterak's blocks all damage and gives regen of up to 1% max hp / sec. So Sterak's definitely just does more, even in many anti-mage cases.
I agree that Maw isn't definitively trash in isolation but you can't buy Maw and Sterak's or Maw and Shieldbow, so you'd rather buy one of those plus a Wit's End.
Read moreUsually, when Vayne is broken, it isn't because she herself is OP but everyone else is garbage in comparison.
Lucian, MF, Jhin, Draven, and Cait all used to be awful match ups for me. These days? Its pretty much only Jhin you see bot.
And remember when Rageblade was every 2 autos? THAT is when Vayne was truly broken, but even then, the item was what broke her and not her kit. 6 autos would do 42% true damage, instead of the normal 28%.
Vayne is actually quite balanced, the game? Not so much. I haven't had a difficult laning phase with Vayne since season 8. All of her lane counters are garbage now. Vayne is pretty much the same she's been for years. Biggest problem is there is no one to make Vayne's lane hard now.
The game as a whole, and new items/runes, are the issue here. Delete Shieldbow from the game, I bet Vayne's WR drops to 49-50% again. If not lower.
Vayne is pretty easy to deal with. I peaked at low Plat, and I ra...
Vayne gained 1% wr from the preseason changes. I couldn't tell you exactly what it was (it wasn't Lethal Tempo, PtA had a similar rise in win rate) that caused it.
So certainly something changed around her that isn't just a better keystone. Could just be that games are looser because it's preseason and Vayne loves a fiesta. Could be that the champion pool around her is beneficial. Nami and Lucian, both champions who have good matchups into Vayne, have gotten less popular in pre-season but I don't think that's enough to explain the effect.
It's super annoying how they keep removing Negatron from every build path. Riot games REALLY hates this component. I can't think of a component item they hate more over the years. It must be intended to be unusable apparently, because building it is seen as "abuse" by riot.
TBH they should consider just making it a bit smaller like what happened with Giant's Belt. Made it fit into a few more builds and right now it's pretty reliably a, "Hey I'm an AP bruiser, I bet I can buy a Giant's Belt and it turns into something good."
Would like to see all the clear MR-focused tank items build from Negatron and find a way to resize things around that. Offensive items can build from Null Magic.
50 MR is the same MR as Negatron cloak. In fact, of the three items that build out of Negatron, only FoN gives more MR than it.
That would be fine... if those 3 items weren't also in the top 5 MR items. Right now a Negatron Cloak alone gives more MR than Spirit Visage or Abyssal Mask, and the same MR as Maw, all of which are supposed to be the MR items.
Including Abyssal Mask in that list is a bit of a lie of omission though, isn't it? It's 37-65 in any reasonable fight. It certainly can be lower but can also be much higher.
Anyway, personally I feel like ~45-50 is a decent spot for a resistance item, generally speaking. I think it's important that a significant portion of the item power is in raw health.
And Maw is trash, sadly.
There exist numbers where her win rate hits 50%
I don't think 50% is balanced without a context. Lux is a fairly easy champion to play. Players don't have to spam her to maintain their performance on her and random pickers can also have a quite easy time playing her. So her win rates should hit higher than 50% to be considered balanced.
According u.gg her all ranks win rates on patch 11.23:
MID SUPPORT 53.28% 52.46% She is not OP, contrarily "balanced" now. That's because of recent trends in League. I don't think 50% WR Akali is balanced.
Lux is:
She's certainly stronger than the average champion right now. Maybe less frustrating, but certainly more successful.
I hope it was restful.
I feel pretty good, thanks!
No idea what point you are trying to make exactly, but the comment I replied to contained a real Riot like bandaid fix where you want to give fountain 50% damage reduction in response to Lux oneshotting the Ashe with just Q-E
Do you not ever felt like the game could need a little tone down in the damage department? Every game I play is decided by one player getting completely blown up because he was out of position, and it doesnt matter if its a squishy carry or a durable tank, they just die in a matter of 1-3 seconds.
Now you could say it was the same in Season 3/4/5 whatever, the key difference is that shit happened back then in like ultra late game and I think thats reasonable so the game doesnt get dragged out for an eternity.
But right now people get blown up as early as minute 20.
I think investigating the actual damage in the game is worthwhile. I can remember when items were far less efficient and the only way to get flat armor penetration was Brutalizer. I remember when there were no fighter items so Renekton and co. literally just build Brutalizer into full tank because there were no other applicable items. There was a time when every mage ran Magic Resist Marks and Athene's Unholy Grail first item so they all had 73 baseline magic resist from the first item onward.
Itemization has gotten more specialized. Fighters can deal meaningful damage late game without having 2k total hp now. Mage itemization has probably landed at higher damage overall but I'm not certain.
I know every time I've investigated support damage, it's going down. Season over season, supports tend to be dealing less damage than the year before. But considering at one point in time the only flat armor penetration item was Youmuu's Ghostblade, I wouldn't be surprised if as...
Read moreFirst off I appreciate the response! I just have one more question, isn't ADC the role meant to deal with the tanks? If GP can one shot squishies AND kill tanks, whats the downside to playing him? I'm not being obstinate, just curious. He does well in lane last time I checked as well, but I could be off on that.
In general, melee champions tend to have either poor target access (fighters) or poor sustained damage (assassins). Gangplank is certainly a bit of a special child, but I'd consider him a caster. Technically he has a melee auto-attack but he's really all about Q/E/R for damage and occasionally autos things when he's forced to, but you're not going to see him right-clicking a Lux any time soon.
So as a mage, yeah he's a bursty boy with decent target access and a big unreliability problem via barrels. If he hits the barrel chains or does a 5Head setup, then he's going to be rewarded. But the oneshot builds have at most Trinity Force or Shieldbow for durability so that champion isn't much more durable than the Ashe he's killing.
Gangplank's weakness is that he doesn't actually win all that often. ~48% win rate. So as much as he has really high points, it's sort of a montage problem: Sometimes he oneshots and looks like the best champion in the game. But that isn't happ...
Read moreRead moreThe defensive options for Marksman champions are slim, and even items like Shieldbow do not ensure sufficient survivability in team fights (the longer the match continues). As a Master ADC, I can not even remember the last time I bought Maw or Mecurial (except mainly on Ezreal), rarely GA; just because of the fact how the current items restrict you to build those items without stunting your scaling (Zeal items are also underwhelming except maybe PD). That is why Marksman mainly build BT as a sort of defensive option, for the lifesteal/shield (yet, Assassins just have to build Fang to counter our shields lol); but also to reach the 100% crit.
ADCs also have been really neglected over the last seasons, they had small patches here and there, big adjustments for Aphelios, Senna or Jinx, but overall, the role has not really benefitted from fundamental changes to tackle core issues (although it was in a certain way intended). But all of those core issues still exist, or became w...
I think allowing Marksmen to take a DPS hit to ramp survival would be a good thing as a frustration outlet. I agree Scimitar and Maw feel bad. That said, Wit’s End is still exceptional.
But regardless bot laners don’t need to switch to another role. Marksmen dominate the overall power level of bot lane. There are like four champions that can compete with the entire crew of marksmen down there.
In general fed carries should oneshot squishies, yes but how? With just a E+Q combo as Lux in the video or should she also use her ultimate at least? LUL
Btw, let's not forget that Lux is an old champion and her kit is already uncreative. If you land your Q, it's guaranteed to land rest of her abilities. She is gonna oneshot Ashe even if she had to use her R but this kind of gameplay is nonbalanceable in modern League.
Seems pretty balanceable to me. There exist numbers where her win rate hits 50%. She’s extremely popular and her ban rate is usually very low when her winrate is fair (she’s currently OP). Seems like a solid champion design to me. Fountain dives notwithstanding, just dodge the Q. It’s more counter-play than most damage champions give you. Champions are allowed to be reliable.
idk Phreak, u played that game longer than I did but u seem to have forgotten that tanks should be durable against "carries" with unreliable DPS, or am I wrong?
Maybe we can soon return to the Rock-Paper-Scissor system that League used to be and not have "fed" carries literally destroy everything in their eyesight
Show me a Rengar that can win a teamfight by going through the Leona first and I’ll show you a team that already had a 90% winrate from their gold lead.
Show me a split pusher that can’t threaten a side lane against Ornn and I’ll show you a tank meta.
Assassins can’t kill tanks fast. But being unable to scratch them is not something you actually want.
Not to mention that ekko’s job isn’t to kill tanks. What kinda logic is “if they can’t one shot squishy’s how are they supposed to kill tanks”. Assassins have burst they aren’t meant to kill tanks.
Ok let’s keep going then: if fed Ekko can’t kill squishies quickly when ahead why ever pick Ekko? Seriously what damage numbers do you need to give the champion for 2 maxed abilities and 600 AP and Lich Bane to not meaningfully threaten 1500 hp and 42 mr? Why build a Deathcap when the AP ratios are 0.15. Why pick the champion at all when the base damages are all 190?
The point still stands that marksmen are very viable. The point still stands that marksmen have the same average durability as mages. What one-shots Ashe also one-shots Syndra. Vayne is currently the single best ban in the game. Outside of Yasuo and very specific single-champion duos there are no strong farming melee champions in bot lane.
Assassins and burst champions one-shotting squishy champions is healthy for the game.
Thanks for letting him know he's allowed to sleep.
Thanks I’m headed to bed now. Good night!
What's your stance on this?
In general if fed carries can’t oneshot squishies how are they meant to kill tanks? Like yeah your tactical gameplay is completely shot when you’re Ashe here but also if AP Ekko doesn’t actually obliterate you with Deathcap Lichbane Rocketbelt Void, then why even bother building anything but tank on him?
I’m back to playing bot lane this season and so far I’ve never felt like any of my deaths are unreasonable. Fed assassins do hella damage. Good. Otherwise they’re not viable.
In this exact case I’m not sure a new mechanic like 50% damage reduction in the fountain would be an improvement to the game. Maybe. But the game is already over when you start getting fountain snipes so just let them have the high point.
last death was avoidable he just had to sell all his items and stack mr and hp /s
I don't think hp/s was going to do it for him. He died in like .1 seconds.
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