HiRezAjax

Let me elaborate a little more on this to clarify:

the average match length will scale up depending on how you pull the data

You cant just say "dont include 10 minute surrenders" in a data set (well you can but its not going to do what you want it to do). You have to choose a minimum acceptable match length.

You could search by flag=was surrendered, but thats generally a bad idea because very close/good/long games can still end in surrender, often right before the titan dies or after a huge fight is lost. Culling out surrenders does generally increase the average match length, but I think it also culls out data that is important to keep.

So instead you have to average all matches over 10m, or all matches over 15m, etc

With that logic - we have internally decided that matches that end before 15m for any reasons are bad matches. You could potentially argue that even 20m is still a pretty rough match now in 9.5 - but I think many reasonable su...

We felt that buffing minion health was important to make sure the early game was still interesting.

If minions die very fast AND everyone is harder to kill - then you get much more in-lane stalemates.

The slower minion clear gives more opportunities for pvp combat, and puts more pressure on HP and Mana management - which is a key factor in skell expression in mobas.

We might tone this down a little but in general we think it was necessary to pair with the god TTK changes.

We aren't really that concerned about "what a moba is supposed to be" but i understand why people are using that term - its a strong reference point to explain what theyre feeling in the game and why the like it.

Often in SMITE history we prided ourselves on being a bit different from the other mobas, and having more combat, more action. However, over time that seemed to push itself too far - and thats why we walked it back. SMITE is still less about farming and laning and other mobas.

Our real main goal was to deliver what SMITE players want, and deliver things that will get them excited to log in and play every day. We saw some great metrics yesterday so I think it was overall a good design - but not necessarily because its more like other mobas.

<3 still checking the data but in general "kill count" seems to have come down but by a pretty small amount

Overall seeing a lot of positive feedback from 9.5 - we do owe Warriors/Solo some love though

thanks!

lol this here is what reddit is all about

ill also go ahead and explain some more - "casual" here is not a perfect description of who within the SMITE community was pushing for changes like this.

We saw lots of feedback about - Warriors are OP, Hybrid items are OP, and Kills are too easy to get - from our top streamers and many players who clearly play at well above a silver level.

Generally the GM and SCC/SPL were less interested in these changes though.

So yea, a lot more people than this hypothetical noob youve invented wanted these changes. and i JUST said we will be looking for ways to bring back warrior strength, so you can relax :)

No, because we just changed everything by such a huge amount.

We just made everyone 40% tankier, so wouldnt it be pretty safe to make one class deal 5-10% more damage if they clearly are the ones who need it the most from player data and feedback?

Even after that buff we are still extremely far away from where we were before. We are seeing pretty much 100% of the negative comments on 9.5 coming from warrior mains (and a small % who just dont want the game to be slower at all) So its pretty clear that warriors/solo need a buff more than other classes after 9.5

We certainly have to be careful about what items we buff to make sure we dont buff the wrong class, and we have to be cognizant of how classes compare against eachother. But the whole point of this thread is to communicate the idea that "warriors need some buffs to even compete with other classes"

Ive seen this kind of opinion a few times, and I dont want to invalidate it outright - but i think its intensely more rare than the opposite case.

Most people seemed very pleased with their gameplay session yesterday. Id say its extremely unlikely that we revert to where we were before. If any revert occurs, it will be slight.

We havent forgotten. EVERYONE got changed this update. and we are going to be looking at every class and role for future balance.

By most data and feedback guardians look fine though. Still strong, even with less ability to kill squishies in the early game (which is exactly what a huge portion of smite players wanted)

Aggro is not misunderstanding warriors. He is just questioning the class/role and discussing if there are any other possibilities.

I think we can both agree that in the infinite possibility world of game development - surely there are other ways that warrior or solo might be played, right? And by played i mean - viable and impactful.

Those ways might be too much change, or not enjoyable to current solo/warrior mains, or too hard to achieve via dev resources - but they surely exist right? All he was saying is that he wants to stay open minded and see if any of those options exist.

You are exactly the type of player he is asking to give it a chance. Try some new things. See what we can learn together.

Its clear that a lot of people have no interest in that, though. And Thats ok. Im not here to validate your concerns about a designers comments - but I am here to reassure all SMITE players on how we plan to handle the entire situation with Solo Laners a...

We will absolutely be working to adjust warriors and solo lane as soon as possible. There are a lot of factors that are combining into this situation, so we always want to gather more data and feedback before we act.

We dont even have a full day of data yet, and we expect to see some interesting decisions from teams in the masters LAN, but we are prepared to buff warriors and their solo lane ability as soon as possible. Even with this feedback in PTS and the closed SPL testing phases - we did not want to act too quickly on it for the following reason:

casual vs competitive player perception.

Casual players perceive Warriors to be simply OP in every way, this is an extremely common sentiment and one that has been common for years. Casual warriors can 1v5 teams by being tanky and dealing high damage at the same time, this can occur in any game mode.

Competitive players see Warriors as jack-of-all-trades - meaning they can do a little of everything but...

We can discuss it!

pets arent gods

It wouldn't be that large of a surprise... we did specifically write in the 9.5 patch notes that these changes might buff healers.

The brawling rule was never intended to take all healers out of the meta, its intended to decrease out-of-combat healing which creates less interesting gameplay and is often a big complaint point for when healers do become meta.

We know that a group of people in this community aren't very keen on the brawling rule and how it was implemented, but the more we look at the more successful we think it was.

Brawling makes sure that high sustain gods need to fight against other gods to get the most out of their sustain. When we implemented brawling we also were very mindful of the various types of healing, and brawling was in fact intended to nerf all of them. Self healer and Lifestealers are also very powerful archetypes in SMITE history, even though they generally draw less rage to them than group healers.

The brawling rule n...

Well the ability mentions leaps. Which includes those underground travel abilities.

What awilix is really looking for is any sort of "leap" state or "rising" or "falling" states.

She cannot pull from banishes. All three of those ults are banishes.

Freya banish does drop enemies from the banish so there actually is a short fall that awilix can pull from

Well this is from 2018 and was clearly in response to some sort of context.

Knockbacks and knockups are the same type of cc and thus the same type of immunity but the direction and momentum applied can be different.

We tend to use knockback for hits that apply mostly horizontal movement. And knockup for mostly vertical.

Generally we tried to use knockback as the default term but then people complain that's it's inaccurate because many are used to knockup or the ability knocks more vertically.

I'd agree that the immunity text could be more consistent and all should say "knockback" because it is in fact the same immunity.

As for other interactions and applications it tends to use the one that's most accurate or relevant. For example. Awilix pull only cares about elevation. It does not care how the enemy gods got there (as long as they aren't cc immune)

yes ive already got a note to the designers to look at some of these ability/item texts to better clarify this. Will work on it for a future update!

youre welcome, sorry about this

the change as listed in 9.5 might ship and remove his procs for some amount of time, but we will undo it as soon as we can to return those item interactions back to him.

thanks for the detailed information. both of those posts are quite recent, was the susano change also recent? or are these likely returning players or players returning to susano for the first time in a while?

Rat most likely needs buffs, not nerfs, i think?

yes

Horus will continue to proc all types of basic attack items on his gust