Minigame was initially designed to scale the NPC threats up to 100 players. A few months later we increase it to 200 (without spawning additional NPCs) to see if it overly affected server performance or caused any issues.
We're aware of the concern with the current player limit, the frustrations of waiting for the next game and the frustrations of not getting in even after waiting. Expect an update soon (tm) with some proposals which could alleviate this issue.
Hey, quick question if you can answer: how do you make sure the lore you’re bringing in, as small as it is, doesn’t conflict with existing lore/potential future lore?
We usually just ask around the team, check wiki, or if we miss things they can get picked up in team sprint reviews or playtesting.
Generally just having game knowledge can help with this too
Hope you guys will be able to revisit GOTR QOL changes soon!
Soon (tm)
Honestly having this teleport locked behind avg of 1k rift searches is insane
I'm always conflicted on this.
The goal of the amulet was never to provide a means of teleporting to the content easier, it was to tell a story. Later on with development in GoTR I wanted add random things you can pull out of the abyssal rift as a thematic, rare drops that would make players go "Oh, what's this?"
The amulet has a story attached to it and adds some lore to the Lumbridge guide which I thought was kinda cool. Then we got some feedback that it'd be nice to offer some benefit to it so I thought a teleport was fairly harmless especially since we already have a fairy ring near the content.
Then I got feedback post-launch that players felt like this should be on the collection log, so now it's in this weird place. I even see feedback every so often asking for it to be an infinite binding necklace but if it was a genuine meta-relevant reward for the piece of content I would never have made it so rare.
As a developer, I generally like to sprin...
Read moreThank you!
I don't suppose there's any data on the current driest iron? I'd very much like to know what KC I need for that god-awful mantel.
I couldn't say personally, I work in content development and not data and analytics.
I know others have had worse dry streaks in general, you're currently just below 8x, I've personally had an 11x (trident), I've seen as high as 13x.
The grind really matters though, 5x on an Ely is worse than 10x on a whip for example. Enhanced seed is definitely up there for a bad one to go unlucky on though!
That's disgusting, good luck with getting it soon, it'll all be worth it
Why don’t you just actually put in the work to fix the shitty course design of Polly/Prif then?
I don’t stick with Seers over Polly/Prif because of xp rates, I do it because I can click the entire course without rotating my camera or clicking twice between steps.
My response to another player:
"I don't think it's unreasonable that we could touch up the layout/interactions of some of the courses as part of this project.
The course just feeling bad to do (from a gameplay perspective) is very different to it feeling bad to do because of the xp rates."
Read moreI doubt you'll see this comment but thats Okay! the write up is really nice but to touch on your questions:
- Are slow skills the problem? Or are boring skills the problem?
Yes and No. if a skill is slow, generally there would be a trade off whether its higher yield in GP/HR, resources, whatever. the problem is when the skill is slow, theres no alternatives to do in the skilling method, and the pay off is just as bad, why would I as a player do something that I don't enjoy if skill X is slow, tedious, and has a terrible pay off that's just not fun, nor a good use of time.- Is Construction a good skill because it's fast?
this is a double edged sword. Construction is fantastic for the QOL it brings to a player, is it a good skill? not really. you're either stuck doing specific facets of construction, or Mahogany homes, and making 67000 mahogany tables isn't enjoyable, nor good for the wrists. and mahogany homes is just tedious.- Is Slayer a bad...
I did see the comment!
Your thought process is generally consistent with mine and it's why I posed those questions at the bottom of my ramble.
I think that looking at a skill's xp rates in a vacuum without considering other metrics is not a good way to evaluate whether or not a skill is good.
One thing I believe the team has to consider is that the reality is that Seers is also just the easiest course to run. Both on mobile and desktop, it requires no camera turns and is very easy to click the boxes. Even with boosted rates Seers is a lot easier to complete for hours than Poll or Relekka, so for it to be the course that sees a small nerf just doesn't feel good
I don't think it's unreasonable that we could touch up the layout/interactions of some of the courses as part of this project.
The course just feeling bad to do (from a gameplay perspective) is very different to it feeling bad to do because of the xp rates.
So now I have to level construction to make house tabs and move my home to Pollniveach (which requires me to schlep out there to even do) so that I can get a 12min total benefit to my agility grind from 60-75 from the current meta of staying at seers through 75? You do see how that’s a general nerf to agility training as it currently exists right?
The addition of a diary locked teleport similar to seers would inevitably make these locations easier to get to. Or were you specifically talking about getting to these courses before the proposed diary reward is unlocked?
I appreciate the transparency, but I feel like reducing the exp/hr just doesn't make sense and it's always going to draw ire from the community (buffs are better than nerfs). I feel as if a better solution to "why would I go to polliv over kandarin when the difference is only 1k exp per hour" should be addressed by adding the same scaling marks to the diary like kandarin has. If polliv is better marks and better exp per hour, then it's strictly better to head out to the desert.
Perhaps there's concerns with the price of amylase, but if we're also discussing amylase coming from more agility courses and also brimhaven, this wouldn't have more of an effect than those?
I don't dislike the idea of looking at the marks of grace a course gives as another balancing metric as a potential solution. I'd need to think on it some more and actually dig out some numbers before coming to any real conclusions though.
Why does agility need such low xp rates? It doesn’t hurt the economy having higher agility or faster training methods.
This is gatekeeping. It should be in line with thieving rates
I also don’t want to hear any argument about devaluing 99 agility for current players because you guys are already devaluing everyone who grinded levels and diaries for agility, which is way more players than those who actually have 99
The discussion about whether or not Agility should be a fast or slow skill was not really something we were planning to address with this project. We just wanted to create a more healthy meta and to make receiving unlocks while training it feel more exciting and meaningful.
Read moreWhat makes a problem skill is a combination of low exp, high focus, constant clicking and no real reward.
Agility is a mix of all of that.
Construction is good because it stands on its own with tons of rewards and its exp rates are insanely bloated while having a choice to take lower exp to save on cost
Slayer is good because there's tons of reward, variety and you get to make a ton of choices in how you handle it
Making a boring skill faster alleviates the burnout and fixes a few of the issues i outlined in the first sentence.
High clicking with more focus for higher exp is fine, higher clicking higher focus with low exp isn't.
Agility can't be afk'd so it'll stay higher focus regardless and most agility rewards aren't worth the squeeze, some shortcuts are great, but if you're leveling agility primarily for that, that's hardly a goal worth 250 hours of mind numbing.
For how much effort agility takes compared to most other ski...
Hopefully my response to another player above provides my thoughts to some of what you raised.
I think the reward aspect of agility is still something we should address and is completely separate from the xp rates of the skill. It simultaneously feels mandatory and underwhelming at the same time and shortcuts don't do enough.
Is Construction a good skill because it's fast?
No, but at least it's not both slow and boring. Agility is both.
I agree that making a boring skill fast is a band-aid solution, but it's at least something, instead of going, "Ah, it's too hard to solve the underlying issue, so I guess we'll put it off for a few years."
Also agility is only boring insofar that you're forced to do non-Sepulcher content. Sepulcher is amazing(plis add amylase to it).
Yeah, the slow and boring part is where Agility definitely sits. I still wouldn't want the change to just be "Make it fast and boring"
My hope is that the introduction of new content can resolve this issue. Sepulchre is only really meta from level 72 onwards (at the very least, it's not as fun to run floors 52 and 62 repeatedly) and I also don't think Sepulchre should be the be-all and end-all from 52-99 either, that was a very intentional design choice.
The proposal mentions a Brimhaven agility rework which I hope can scratch the itch of being fun while also providing more XP/hr at the relevant levels for those who want to pay more attention.
Hey, I'm going to try and explain the methodology for the process of reaching the numbers we did for the agility rework just for full transparency so that the full context is out there to be reviewed as to whether or not it is "good" or "bad". From this, I'd hope that the full context can aid in the discussion and help us get relevant feedback to review.
First up, the design goals were not to directly buff agility or nerf agility, we instead were looking at how content was positioned throughout the skill and to see if we could reach a healthier meta for agility as a whole and several things stood out to us.
Why Tirranwn first out of curiosity?
Because I like Tirranwn and going there first will be the most fun for me!
Tirranwn > Kourend > Desert
Wish I would have thought of that earlier, it's now lost in the game ticks of time!
This should now be resolved!
Sorry for the issue, I'm praying on behalf of you for good RNG on the second +5 boost!
The Agility one also makes it so you can't fail obstacles - that's directly gameplay buff.
Huh, is this new? I never saw it on the wiki, which just says it's a graceful cape with 1 restore of run energy per day.
Sorry, my bad, this is what happens when I try to remember something off the top of my head to give an example
Hey, I'd just like to add a disclaimer for those who see this thread and peruse the slides.
These were given as part of a presentation on our 'Discord Stages' today which included a lot more detail than is written on the slides from design philosophy, further explanations etc.
We'll release a blog next week with a more full-on deep-dive and a lot more information on this, so keep your eyes peeled!
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