Factorio Dev Tracker

Originally posted by Schmogel

Hey kovarex, I know you mean no harm to anyone, but I think you should be more careful about the way you communicate. People mistake your disdain of cancel culture for you defending what is being canceled. Two things to consider:

1. Saying bigoted things has to have consequences. Otherwise bigotism spreads. The most efficient way for an average Joe to do something about it is to warn others. /u/d40b did not "cancel" the valuable information Uncle Bob has to offer, he simply asked in a nice way to add a disclaimer that Bob is not the nicest person.

2. Hating on cancel culture is something that's prevalent in right wing circles, mostly because they're upset they can't just say whatever they want without consequences. If you're not careful people will assume you're part of that group.

Originally posted by Informal_Computer_94

youre putting this into a very cohesive paragraph just for kovarex, but i dont think he'll ever understand it outside of his bubble of "people are being deplatformed for having different opinions"

its becoming clearer and clearer the longer and longer he continues to go on, that he sees this as nothing more than an irrational reaction to another person having what he thinks is a differing opinion, he will NOT acknowledge bipoc or lgbt people being affected by these "differing opinions", he will NOT acknowledge that supporting the american police is an act of bigotry, its very clear he wont change his mind about it, its very ingrained into his thought process

Originally posted by smashmouthultimate

Let's be clear:

Anyone defending American police right now is defending an epidemic of murders against people of color and other minority communities. Putting yourself out there to defend police is directly putting yourself in opposition to the cause "attacking" the police: an effort for accountability and a stop to the violence.

That's why people think it makes him a bad person.

Originally posted by reik483

In this blog post Uncle Bob argues that thinking women are genetically inferior coders is something people should be allowed to say without consequence. http://blog.cleancoder.com/uncle-bob/2017/08/09/ThoughtPolice.html

Originally posted by cdmistman

There is no reasoning for these beliefs because every piece of reasoning has already been debunked. Name an argument that Uncle Bob has made in defense of his beliefs and I'll provide you as many links as you'd like debunking the argument. Every argument in defense of racism, sexism, transphobia, etc has already been debunked because none of them are exactly new.

A common argument in favor of not making a woman president is "women have periods so they can't always make objective decisions." Super easy argument to debunk: humans factor emotions into their decisions constantly, so there isn't a single president in history who hasn't made subjective decisions.

Arguments for not making a woman SSE range anywhere from "because they're dumb" (there's no evidence suggesting women have naturally lower intelligence) to "what if she needs maternity leave" (which is just a shit stance in the first place because studies show babies are more healthy when connected to all parents...

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Originally posted by loldudester

Ah yes these mystical people with their ability to "deplatform" anyone they disagree with at will. Uncle Bob has 160 thousand followers on Twitter. He manages to be heard by many despite being a shitty person. But he's being deplatformed, right?

Cancel culture does not exist. It has no meaningful impact on people who are already in privileged positions.

Originally posted by loldudester

Let's imagine those two groups of people.

Group A says "I hate gay people".

Group B says "I hate people who hate gay people".

These groups are not equivalent. Group A is bigoted.

Originally posted by cdmistman

... i think i understand your semi-coherent statement?

if you have people with beliefes A and B, people from A call Bs bigots because they are attached to B and vice versa

I'm going to assume this was supposed to be "if you have people with beliefs A and B, people from A call Bs bigots because Bs are attached to a belief that is intolerant of A and vice versa"

You are half-correct. There's an inherent difference between being intolerant of what people are vs what people believe. You yourself were talking about how it'd be dangerous to link to Stalin because he believes in Communism, which is inherently violent (I'm going to respect rule 3 here and not try and prove why you're wrong about that). From this statement, you admitted that you believe certain beliefs are dangerous and you would prefer that fewer people held those beliefs because they result in loss of life. This is not covered by the definition of "bigot...

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Originally posted by Throwaway-whatnow

What is

"So all it takes is to take everything personally, so everything that anyone tells to me and I don't like is personal attack and should be blocked or locked?"

If not whining to the mods?

Originally posted by mkyfor

you haven't been arrested my man, free speech's still here. calm the f**k down, you were just being dumb.

Originally posted by Peglaci

Speaking from my own experience just now, news of this debacle is quickly reaching outside of this subreddit.

Surely you have enough awareness of how the internet works to know that doubling down here is suicide, right or not.

If you don't, well, I really hope your coworkers can reel you in before you do too much damage.

Originally posted by triggerman602

How to chill? Put down the phone and go do something else. Get away from this because all you're doing is making things worse.

How is this bad PR? Well you're at the center of a politically charge argument on your developer account making yourself look like a right wing asshole. I pray I don't see an article in a couple days about how the creator of Factorio is a right wing asshole. The things you do and say as kovarex reflect on not only your reputation but Wube's as well. Stop this now because you have nothing to gain from it.

Originally posted by IronCartographer

The problem is that "cancel culture" is a term often used by people that are unaware of their own instances of employing such behavior hypocritically.

Self-awareness is perhaps the most precious thing in this life, and its name is a poor reflection of the necessary component of seeing how we affect others.

Originally posted by cdmistman

I'll leave one recommendation: learn what it actually means to make an argument. Your comment did the following things, none of which were productive to your argument:

• "I made exactly the same mistake as the crowd calling everyone bigot"
  • Hyperbole - you're exaggerating who gets called a bigot, when that's not the case. There are plenty of people not being called bigots, because there are plenty of people that aren't bigots (Uncle Bob is a bigot because he openly talks about his bigotry. There is no reason to believe Brian Kernighan is a bigot because he hasn't said anything I'm aware of that could display bigotry.)
• Provided the definition of a bigot
  • This is good, actually - it means you learned something today :)
• You "safely" claim 99.99% of people are bigots "in one way or another".
  • This is a baseless claim, not founded on any evidence or studies or anything of the sort. You're just making a claim ...

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Originally posted by Throwaway-whatnow

Typical lol, whine about cancel culture and then complain to the mods that they aren't removing every post you don't like.

Originally posted by triggerman602

Dude, chill. You're making some really bad PR for yourself and we all know everything on the internet doesn't go away.

Originally posted by TRE_ShAdOw_69

Dude, many others including myself looked up to you because of your work practices and how well the game is made.

You're basically digging your own grave by continuing to be hostile towards everyone that's calling you out.

Originally posted by nckl

I wonder if the developer knew or cared how many trans people actually loved this game. It's got its own cult following. Just f**king flushed on a random Friday morning on a whim.

Originally posted by cdmistman

or you could just not use ad hominems or other kinds of hostile language when you're on a high horse talking about how you're more rational than people who are trying to tell you that you shouldn't promote somebody who has dismissed rationality. It's that easy.

Originally posted by ocbaker

Let me talk with the moderators and see if we make an exception for removing comments from Wube employees when they violate the rules, as I see what you are trying to get at.

EDIT: After a discussion, we've decided the rules apply to everyone, even an official person, and we've always had a policy of removing personal attack comments from the subreddit. kovarex's views are visible in his other comments in the chain, no meaningful information has been lost from leaving this comment removed.