devtrackers.gg
Will there be adjustments to account for the resource divide between mana based and manaless and energy champions the number of abilities needed per fight rises?
This is an area we are watching closely, and will adjust if needed
Will there be adjustments to account for the resource divide between mana based and manaless and energy champions the number of abilities needed per fight rises?
This is an area we are watching closely, and will adjust if needed
Read moreHot take from a Kaisa and Vayne main. Kaisa will become trash tier unless you also buff her burst damage from level 1 since her range is so short that she can never take lots of little poke trades. You pair Kaisa with supports like Leona, Blitzcrank, Nautilus, Pyke. If Kaisa and her support land every key skill and don't get a kill she'll become worthless as a champion and by the way she usually gets her early kills by a single auto or hitting W for a passive proc.
Vayne on the other hand will become insanely broken given her interaction with the broken new version of Lethal Tempo. Silver bolts value is about to go through the roof since it's percent max health true damage.
Not adjusting both Kaisa and Vayne before this goes live is really stupid. I'll be OK I guess thanks to Vayne, but it's gonna be sad almost never playing Kaisa again.
I'm hoping data from the PBE will actually be considered and if players truly hate it this whole idea is scrapped BEF...
You should allow your personal bias to take a back seat for a moment.
We intend to micropatch immediately based off data for any champion that is significantly outside of balanced bands. That means that Kai'Sa (or vayne) will not remain weak/strong for too long. Balancing off PBE where X champion main (who is 1/10,000,000 of our players and likely only in the US) is giving subjective feedback about how their character feels is extremely unlikely to be more effective than balancing for the entire playerbase. As noted in the article, there are so many champions/systems that we know are going to be imbalanced and we are committing to remedying any rough patches immediately.
I'm asking moreso for examples of what they want things to look like in the future. Like a hypothetical scenario and how it would play out in the present contrasted with how they want it to play out in the future.
Zed kills you because he lands 2-3 shurikens in his R combo, but does not kill you when he doesn't land any skillshots and just hits E+auto attack.
My hot take is that it was better to reduce damage than to increase durability. Let's just hope, in the future, damage doesn't need a buff, otherwise we will be back at square one, but with more damage than before.
Still, I'm excited for the changes.
In theory yes, but that is easier said than done.
How riven is allowed to be so broken for so long ???
That is not related to the durability update.
Did u guys forget to nerf deaths dance aswell?
Its one of the most busted items right now that also heals a alot, and considering fighters will be even harder to burst down in a team fight this item should defenitely be getting nerfed.
Also i feel like some lethality or atleast dirk should also be getting nerfed, the amounts of damage they bring to rotations early game is too high (dirk itself basically eclipses every other early game component item in the game at its cost).
Deaths dance is an anti-burst item, which should make it comparably weaker in a world with less burst. We did not pre-nerf deaths dance (I think?) because we can just nerf it right after if it's a problem still. Predicting every item in the game and spending time adjusting them just to likely have to adjust again is not an effective strategy.
Will the -10% healing change be enough to counteract the grevious nerfs and survivibilty buffs that make healers stronger? Or will they be getting a larger nerf then -10%?
If we need to go harder/softer we will adjust. We took a general swing at as many champs as we could but didn't value exact precision on first attempt.
Whats the plan for balancing bruisers vs assassins, especially bruisers like Lee Sin that are doing assassin-level damage anyway? Now that it seems bursting is weaker, isnt the gap between the 2 just gonna increase more?
The intention is that bruisers will not have assassin-level burst in this world and should benefit from sustained combat, especially in skirmishes.
Pets, esp Daisy and Tibbers should get a similar durability buff, as they are going to be in fights longer.
Noted
Question, if Pyke mid is gone this patch could pyke support get this nerf reverted?
V10.14
Stats
Magic resistance growth reduced to 1.25 from 1.5.
Armor growth reduced to 3.5 from 5.
That's unrelated to the above, but if he ends up weak we can buff support in a way that won't impact mid. I'm unfamiliar with how we would do that, it's not my area of expertise.
100% uptime skirmishers are already broken in solo queue (read: every DD jungler, and jungle in general). this is a buff to all of them.
alternatively, burst mages (syndra, lux, zoe) won't be able to do what their kit is designed around. are you going to significantly lower their cooldowns?
I expect skirmishers to be stronger on release as well. We do anticipate a lot of the risks y'all do, and intend to follow-up quickly if it ends up being true.
For burst mages we will decide which ones need more damage (Zoe and Lux) vs more Rotations/cooldowns (Orianna Syndra) if they end up weak.
Why did you choose to do flat changes across the board as opposed to champ specific? Tanks already don't feel tanky and I don't think just giving them more health, armor, and mr are gonna fix that when the number of things that make stacking resistances meaningless are still there, even if they are getting nerfed slightly.
Also why is only Doran's Ring mana regen getting buffed? I feel like many tanks or other top lane champs could also use help with early mana regen without being forced into a suboptimal starting item.
Flat changes across the board are the easiest and "least biased" way to reduce damage in league. If we find afterwards that a class is being underserved, we can address their items/systems/champs specifically after.
Dorans ring is there because we found mana mages were the least likely to hit kill thresholds where champions have significantly more HP from level 1. It's possible tanks could use an adjustment to mana in the future if we find tanks follow the same trend.
I know all the armor/mr buffs are on a per level basis. Is there any consideration for giving all Champs just a flat base armor/mr? Like instead of the extra durability runes we get to slept from on our rune page could we not just give those to all Champs at lvl 1? +6 armor and +8 mr would help alot in the early game. Or would that make some champions in the jungle too safe?
The flat HP we are giving should cover the early-game case you're talking about. We considered flat durability stats but we found that we did not want to lower, say, the level 1 auto attack damage number significantly. If we gave bot laners 6 armor, that would run the risk of making early auto attacks really wimpy and not satisfying.
Read moreI don't believe this addresses the problem correctly.
The complaint is that there is too much damage in the game. A very, very large percent of that damage comes from the runes and item proc's.
You address this by giving everyone more durability.
It feels super bad as some of my favorite champs to be forced to wait for my runes + items to be ready in order to combo someone, instead of playing the champion and their kit. While it does provide extra interaction, i feel the scale is tipped way too far.
By adding extra durability, and not addressing any item / rune damage, all you do is force people to trade on cycles with their runes / items, and make abilities themselves even more meaningless without them.
Cool items are fun thematically, but when every item is adding 50-200 damage on my abilities BEFORE stats for scaling, it really feels like it doesn't matter what ability I level first, as long as I know what items i have.
This...
Our current assessment is that the proportion of in-kit damage to item/runes damage is not so far off that we'd target that for adjustments. We don't identify "in-kit power vs item system power" to be the leading problem with league in comparison to just overall time-to-kill.
Do you have any concerns about some damage dealing oriented champions to start building too tanky? I REALLY don't want to go back to bruisers being built extremely tanky and replacing actual tanks.
Our impression is that this is very unlikely, but we will be monitoring to see if the meta shifts that way and would react.
Any planned changes for corrupting potion? Bonus defensive stats early feels like a huge buff to corrupting potion which was already dominating pro midlane, since you get more effective hp from the healing to higher resistances and the bonus available mana seems stronger than just mana buffs to d ring.
No "plans" for anything related to items/champions/etc that are stronger/weaker due to the changes. With that said, we will be monitoring closely on live and reacting to what happens. If we "planned" to nerf Sunderer for example, we would have just done it pre-ship like some of the other systems we did. We recognize some items/systems are more likely to need follow-up and we are watching to see how they move.
Any plans for Divine Sunderer? Aside from across the board buffs, the main reason tanks have trouble atm is Divine Sunderer. There are some really weird synergy cases with champions that "shouldn't" be using them, like Camille for example. All the reasoning behind a Camille commiting with her E > killing or failing goes out the window when she can go in and out while not getting punished for it because of DS and Death's Dance.
No "plans" for anything related to items/champions/etc that are stronger/weaker due to the changes. With that said, we will be monitoring closely on live and reacting to what happens. If we "planned" to nerf Sunderer for example, we would have just done it pre-ship like some of the other systems we did. We recognize some items/systems are more likely to need follow-up and we are watching to see how they move.
Do you think tanks will be relatively nerfed by this as they gain much less % durability?
The math works out where they gain less % durability but more raw durability due to armor/mr multiplying on HP and vice versa. We found that flat durability was more valuable than % durability in a decent number of cases.
- How is this going to affect champions like Ivern and Yorick with their ults?
- I didn't get a full sense of the answer by reading the Gameplay Thoughts so I wonder how this is impacting champions with shielding or shields? If you lower healing and up survivability is that an immediate buff to enchanters or tanks with Shields (Nautilus, Tahm Kench etc)?
- Partially to do with the above, but how would this then affect itemization for said enchanters with heal/shielding power, and does this also mean nerfing champions with healing abilities (Senna, Kayle, Nidalee, Sona, and so on)
This seems like a wide scope project that could potentially be even wider scope and unintentionally buff enchanters to the moon if they aren't addressed (this coming from a support that doesn't want tank supports and the like to be booted out because Shields become king again)
No effect currently on pets
Practically all in-kit heals/shields are nerfed in one way or another. That means all heal/shield abilities
> Assassins drop in winrate
> Riot buffs them to overwrite these changes
> The cycle begins anew
One of the things we did that isn't part of the patch is we spent time aligning on what good looks like for various classes.
For Assassins specifically - I think it is very likely they will be less powerful and we need to buff them (though that'll be followup, not pre-buffs).
In general, we are comfortable with burst characters killing their targets very quickly - the problem we're solving right now is that many of them can do it while building bruiser items and getting too durable, or without needing to pass any key skill tests, and sometimes even without having to commit their full kit (we don't want Zed killing an ADC with just QWE+AA when they're on even gold), and that too many characters who have other strengths are also able to one-round a squishy champion without giving anything up.
If we need to buff Assassins just by win rate, we'd first check to make sure they can secure kills on squishy targets when they're building burst damage items (l...
Read more