Can you though? The blog quotes 56.8k xp/h for the average player w/o looting at 72 agility. Anybody can get similar or higher xp/h on the Seers course. It just seems the extra effort required for the Sepulchre is not significantly rewarded pre-floor 4.
That's competitive with the seers course with the kandarin diary reward and I was able to get quite comfortably above 60k with the current balancing in testing which is better rates than ardy course at 72 if you get really good at it.
It should be balanced around giving up loot to achieve higher xp though...
Now it's just 1 method that's worse than choosing between the checks and balances of the previous methods. It went from balanced to wasting time looting.
This is the actual reverse of how balancing anything should be done. You've reduced the viability of alternative methods and players are completely unrewarded for speedrunning a timed course with PBs.
It amazes me that it takes this many discussions and this much time to figure out such a simple and fair concept. There will always be community that will stroke developer ego beyond common sense, they're detrimental to reasonable discussion. Sepulch should be reverted to release at the very least.
Giving up xp to loot, completing faster runs to gain xp and miss loot = Perfection.
I am not sure why you think that you still don't get better xp from missing out loot. You can still vastly exceed rooftop xp rates and looting xp rates if you skip the coffins, all I did was make the gap between them smaller but the faster you can do runs the bigger that gap gets anyway
What is the point of having Sepulchre available pre 82 agility if rooftop agility can out pace the xp rates at those levels?
Assuming you hit the times we quoted in the blog you will be getting more xp rates than rooftops even if you are looting after todays changes and you can even exceed the rates we've quoted in the blog if you are better than the times we quoted.
I still love selp and I think its the best thing to happen to agility and will prefer this.
Those benchmarks are based on average players average times or what? How many failed traps are there? Because at the lowest floor its ~30 second cost alone.
I guess I'm just shit, theres no way im getting 75k/h even when just going for the last coffin. But I suppose thats more my problem.
It's hard to say how much skill is required as it's not really a measurable thing and I can't really use myself as a benchmark because I've got more practice than the player we're balancing around.
Generally I got rough estimates from other members of the team and did runs myself where I did not use any tick-perfect movements, generally didn't make more than 1 mistake on floors 3,4 and 2 mistakes were allowed on floor 5 and then just used that to base the times and I tried to consider the average time regardless of where you spawn into the floors rotation and which route you get given.
So it's not an exact science but hopefully this helps to explain. Mistakes are still very vague because failing at the start of the final trap on floor 5 can cost 4-5 seconds but failing at the end is significantly more
Buffing the loot is great but why nerf those who are going for xp? Don't hurt players who want the most xp they are sacrificing loot.
It's only a slight nerf and I wouldn't read into the nerfing of the xp-rates and instead look at our quoted xp-rates and what we consider to be a good goal time to aim for.
None of those times quoted in the blog are that unreachable for someone who puts the time in to learn the content and those xp-rates are still significantly better than rooftops (for floors 3,4 and 5)
I voted no to hallowed sepulchre because I knew it’d be yet another dead content Agility course.
Got to love having another wasted content developing time, that could’ve been used elsewhere
You are perfectly entitled to your opinion and this is why we have a voting system in the game to gauge player interest in the content we are pitching.
It's always going to be the case that we can never please everyone with any update and there are going to be people who would rather we spent time doing something else, however, I have seen a lot more praise for the course than against it and it is certainly not 'dead content' as it is considered to be more profitable and more xp/hr than rooftops once you've learned it.
At the very least I hope that we can release some content in the future that you deem to be worth the development time :)
Try actually reading it. It's an xp buff if you are looting, and only a slight nerf if you aren't, still leaving it well above the rates described in the poll blog.
Not to mention they also made looting runs faster than they were due to the lockpick buff, and more profitable due to not needing level 7 enchant with the hallowed focus.
Edit: deleted comment was something like "lol sepulchre nerf ded content"
Yep, the speeding up looting with the tools should hopefully have a notable impact on xp-rates as you invest more time into the activity and actually make them feel like more worthwhile upgrades!
[deleted]
A slight nerf to people ignoring the loot and going for top xp-rates but a fairly significant buff to the xp for people who were looting coffins and seeing sub-par rates
Why is selp getting nerfed? The learning curve and attention required does not warrant such a low rate over other top agility imo. Its hard to do constant 100% success runs a regular person gets the same xp as ardy probably.
The XP from running through and getting no loot has been slightly reduced but you will see an increase in xp/hr if you are looting and going for marks/rewards.
Also, as stated, those are the benchmark times we decided to balance the XP/HR around and it is absolutely possible to get quicker floor completions (and hence XP/Hr) than we've stated.
Do you have data on that any of the current records for any floors or the overall WR has been done without using the firemaking run glitch? As far as I can tell all the current records have been using the glitch. I've been tryharding the Sepulchre for 50+ hours and my PB overall is 6:14, however I can see how one might barely get a sub 6-minute, maybe even down to 5:50 with being tick perfect and very lucky with portals/arrows. Shaving off another 30 seconds to that seems impossible.
The WR was done using alts to hold open instances on quiet worlds and entering at specific cycles to ensure a good layout and it comes down to portal RNG aswell. I know that the time is still very much beatable currently aswell even if it does require a "god-run"
I will admit to only having it at face value after speaking to the WR holder that it wasn't using barb-fm and I'd believe it since it only shaved off a few cycles in very specific circumstances which is why it will affect floor PBs more than full run PBs, if anything the recent fire trap changes might've had a bigger impact on WR than anything else.
Could we see clue scrolls added to hallowed sepulchre? Possibly having the coffins on each floor give a specific tier, or higher level coffins giving higher tier clues more frequently. Would be nice to have more skilling alternatives to clue gathering, and HS seems like a perfect spot.
I think adding clues could be a cool idea as long as only the grand coffin had a chance at elites. Definitely something we could add to a future poll
How would you feel about the the Mysterious Stranger within the Hallowed Sepulchre acting as a tool leprechaun for storing the minigame equipment?
I like this but it may have to be content taken by another team perhaps on a future poll since I won't really have the time to do that work that would take as long as that now that I've moved onto the leagues project.
Can we get a reset of the Hallowed Sepulchre leaderboards, now that the world records are impossible to beat? From what I can gather the previous world records were set using the firemaking-run glitch with barbarian firemaking, which was removed from the activity last patch.
I think a reset is kind of required except it would feel very harsh to punish the current WR holder considering that run is still very beatable and didn't use the firemaking-run glitch.
I may selectively have to remove certain floors which are offenders, do you happen to know which specific times are unbeatable?
If I can't selectively get that list a full wipe may be in order but I would only want to do that once I am certain no more changes are coming to the content so we don't have to wipe again after that.
Read moreIn the Gauntlet players are able to create crystal weapons and armor including the bow, halberd, and staff. Would you consider adding a unique drop (same rate as crystal weapon/armor seed) to The Gauntlet that would allow players to sing crystal weapon seeds into a Crystal Staff? image linked below
This would take minimal dev time (model and animations already exist in game), make thematic sense (can sing a bow or halberd already), and would create a new trident class weapon for accounts able to complete Song of the Elves and The Gauntlet. It could be charged with crystal shards, giving another use for shards and encouraging players to engage in more Prifddinas content.
Balancing: The two main trident weapons already have tradeoffs, between cost to use, and healing vs venom. The Crystal Staff would be charged with crystal shards, not directly costing money but requiring the player to spend time in Prifddinas for shards or buy Crystal Seeds/Acorns to convert to shar...
I kind of like the thematic idea behind a crystal staff, however we'd have to think about the implementation and balancing for sure.
Read moreNot sure where else to post this, but I just finished my dark graceful/acorn grind, and I'd like to share some of my thoughts on the hallowed sepulchre.
Ports in general just feel bad. I generally avoid taking blues during arrow traps because the risk:reward ratio doesn't make sense. You can save like 2 ticks taking one, but if they make you run into an arrow then you lose 20-30. They also don't appear consistently enough or last long enough for you to develop a strategy around them. Some suggestions:
Blue ports persist for longer, or at least have some sort of visual indicator for when they're about to expire. Traps with rows of 3 blue (eg. sword + port traps) should always have 1 active port per row (right now there can be a 1? tick gap, kind of annoying).
Remove situations where blue ports put you directly onto a lightning square. I'm not sure if this was intentional to make it more difficult, but players can't realistically react to this...
Hey, I don't mind answering all of these points.
Portals
Agree that they require an animation to signal that they are about to activate and that they are about to expire. I've added the work to our backlog but it's dependent on when an artist can get round to it as opposed to anything I can do content side.
Disagree with the placing on lightning, there is a 2 cycle window of opportunity to react after teleporting which already feels very generous and I feel like with the first change to animations you should only be taking the portal if you either couldn't react to the portal or you took the calculated risk and were ready to react to it.
Fire trap on north floor 4
I'm kind of neutral on this but I don't really want to do any more work which could speed up the completion times of the Hallowed Sepulchre especially after the work done in tomorrow's update regarding xp-rates. It does matter though if you get s...
Don't take us back there. My Rogue went through so much.
I was THAT enhancement shaman purposely spreading flame shock to as many bloods as possible so I could max out my DPS with fire nova
The inception of the idea for the dark squirrel came from me wanting to have something to spend hallowed marks on once you'd finished the dark graceful set and which would be both desirable enough that people would want it yet also completely optional so you didn't feel forced to do it. I figured that a pet recolour would be a good way to go about that.
I honestly wish every pet recolour we've ever pitched could have a matching piece of content you'd have to earn it from however the vast amount of pet recolour ideas outweighs the amount of content we can design for them so we end up with this inconsistency.
I honestly don't see it as an issue and I know many people support the expensive cost even if it is a little excessive in hindsight, at the very least we've sped up getting marks from initial release so it's not as bad as it was!
Maybe /u/jagexhusky could make it happen, he did a great job with HS, would be cool to see another alternate agility method that involved some sort of combat
I'm getting spine of deathwing flashbacks just looking at this suggestion haha
I completely understand and agree with the idea of sacrificing xp/hour to get the tradable rewards like the ring, strange lockpicks, alchs etc but I guess I feel that the marks, which only buy untradables, shouldn't be tightly coupled to getting the tradable rewards and sacrificing xp.
Just wanted to mention that this is some of the most enjoyable old school content I've played in a really long time, never thought I'd be itching to finish work to train agility, so thank you for that and please keep doing what you do.
No problem! Glad you're enjoying the content.
We may just have to agree to disagree on the untradeable reward thing but at the very least after this weeks and next weeks changes you should see yourself getting more xp/hr than previously while grinding out those marks
Thanks for the same generic reply to me for the 3rd time, still ignoring the issue.
Literally not ignoring the issue as the comment I made and the statement of the blog said we're going to adjust it next week.
If you feel like the changes after we make them are not good enough for the content then you are entitled to provide said feedback like any other player.
If you are still not getting the xp-rates which we are quoting then perhaps the timed benchmarks we provide will indicate any improvements you can maket. This content shouldn't be rewarding to players who are not good at it.
devtrackers.gg