Changes look really cool, could I ask why you guys decide to make his durability less sustain bound, was it because he was just too stat checky with it
The R change reduces his free access to diving targets (it can go infinite - but if you're being kited around, it won't). If he's not as guaranteed to be able to dive the back line successfully, he needs his alternate game plan to be better, which means the tools to not just auto-lose fights on the front line.
Hey boss. I have a more holistic angle when it comes to my questions regarding these changes.
Directionally, I was always under the impression that Olaf is not a great scaler into the later game. Do you feel these changes go against that scaling profile?
That being said, what is the stance of the team when it comes to potentially homogenising scaling identities across the board? Personally I think it goes against what LoL stands for and greatly reduces aspect of the game like strategy, team comps, and sharp champion identity.
From our playtesting, he's less bad late game, but still not very good (even for a Juggernaut) - contrast his teamfight power to Sett, Darius, or Illaoi, for example.
Right now I don't think we have a strong stance about it. We aren't trying to homogenize it, but we aren't resisting it too strongly - it's more about what is right for a particular champion. If we go very far towards homogenization, then we'd need to deal with that, but we still do shotcall things like a very extreme late game curve for Gwen, and some of our other midscopes in flight aren't moderating scaling curves like this one is.
The Olaf mid scope update is coming to PBE today with an intended ship date of patch 12.9 (not 12.8). Putting him up early for feedback, so he should be on PBE for about a week, and then he’ll disappear as we prep patch 12.8. He’ll return to PBE when we kick off the 12.9 cycle.
Before getting into the actual changes, let’s talk goals. One common response to the initial announcement was confusion as to why he’d be next up on the list for an update.
Olaf has a number of urgent issues we’re looking to address. First, he is (and has consistently been) the least deeply played champion in League—on average, that is (Olaf one tricks don’t @ me.) If Olaf is a champion you play, he probably makes up the lowest percent of your games played, and has consistently been among the lowest for many years now. Second, he’s a deeply pro-bound champion: his win rate is kept lower than would otherwise be ideal because he tends to take over pro play when his kit is tuned to win games in...
Read more External link →You buy QSS because you want to cleanse CC.
I buy QSS because it builds into the only item that offers both crit chance and MR.
We are not the same.
QSS is for situations where a CC spell makes you stop dealing damage. Renata ult does not make you stop dealing damage. Simple enough, right?
...and does your answer change if the ADC has a QSS and you know he isn't going to use it?
Hey BSlav are you the designer working on him or do you only have eyes for Draven
He has axes
Read moreEveryone seems super focused on Taliyah (which I can understand, she has been weak for too long) and for her it seems like there are too many possible directions that it becomes hard to imagine what happens.
AoE Q makes sense, changing the passive so her roamcapability is weaker at the same time I could see as well, how she interacts with worked ground has changed before and I could see it change again, maybe her ult empowers her abilities in some way so she is gated by ult CD a bit, which could also allow them to unlock her from mid via AoE Q, since she doesn't always have her full power like she currently has, W could apply grounded instead of (or in addition to?) interacting with dashes by damaging them.
So many ways she could get changes, but Olaf? What are they going to change? His ult has to remain pretty much the same, I guess they could move the passive resistances/AD depending on if it is active or not atm around? I also can't see how they would change his ...
Idk, I am honestly more interested in what they do with Olaf because it seems harder to add depth into his kit without fundamentally changing it.
It was an interesting challenge for sure.
I used to be with "it," but then they changed what "it" was.
Now what I’m with isn’t "it" anymore and what’s "it" seems weird and scary.
It’ll happen to you.
It’ll happen to you.
Can confirm
Reading between the lines of that post, I got the impression that Riot scrapped the idea.
Just want to be clear - the "Apply a global 20% damage modifier" version of that work was never going to ship. It was a useful, informative playtest that uncovered two major findings: (1) that we believe there's a better version of the game where we have reduced overall damage outcomes, and (2) here are some of the places we need to account for when we look for a shippable implementation.
The list of findings I posted was not a list of fatal objections or reasons why we would never do this; it was a list of the kinds of challenges we need to be ready to overcome while doing it.
We are currently at the step of actually doing that nuanced work - finding the good version, getting it ready to ship, and making sure we are ready to account for the impact of it.
What the hell happened to the 20% damage nerf that was in testing btw? I remember Treatz proposed something like that and Riot decided to put it into testing, why didnt this go live?
We are actively working on finding the good, nuanced version of reducing overall damage in the game.
We are hoping to ship during the season if possible. There's not a good update I can give right now other than we're working on it, we're hoping to ship it when it's ready, and we're willing to ship it during the season instead of having to wait til preseason if we're able to land it, aside from specific launch windows like playoffs/MSI or the leadup to Worlds.
If we come to the conclusion something is bad, we assess the priority to change or remove it.
What metrics would be looked at to help decide if a dragon change is ideal or not? Beyond user feedback I mean.
We're fielding a survey. It'll be a bit before we get results. The reddit and English-speaking social media backlash is clear, but that hasn't always meant players overall disliked a feature in the past.
(This does NOT mean that Reddit feedback is worthless, just that y'all are a subset of players and we want good data)
How dare Riot devs be excited for a champion they've been working on.
Don't worry I'll take care of it
If only
ಠ_ಠ
I'm sold
finally, i hope it's intentional and stays like this
It is intentional and we intend to keep it like this. Our bad on messaging.
Riot has talked about their playtesting team before, with former pros & high elo players & whatnot. I wonder if they've done tests with environment variables in place - what does the game look like if all damage is reduced by 10%? What does the game look like if all healing is reduced by 20%?
My theory is that if they reduced all damage by 10%, they'd actually see kills & action go way down, because what are now tiny windows for survivability would be way larger, even with just a little bit of damage pulled off the top. Maybe that would be good for the game - more macro, adjusting risk tolerance to allow more big fights. Or maybe it turns everything into a slog & no one bothers fighting.
We have recently playtested with all damage from champions to champions reduced by 20%, and all healing and shielding reduced by 20%. Some findings:
On PBE, i believe there were some changes to Janna, one of which was to remove the E cooldown reduction for landing a knock up. Is this something that is still being considered for her rework?
We pushed it back a patch to allow us to respond to feedback. I don't believe we've made final calls on what mechanics, if any, will change as a result, though.
Oh don't worry. If we actually end up with a tank meta this subreddit will relentlessly cry about it too.
This is honestly the hardest thing about working on League - nobody is actually a League player, they're Kindred-Shyvana players and Kled-Pantheon players and Yasuo-Yone-Zed players and Tristana-Draven-Samira players, whatever their position preference and champion choice is.
This is a strength of the game and a big reason it has so much wide appeal, but it means that for any given player, they're running into unfair-feeling games routinely and then seeing Riot not do anything about, and it means we're always balancing one player's needs against another's. There are very few unequivocal wins for us to take and most decisions we make hurt the game for someone.
while tank meta is a boogeyman to riot, they have been indirectly buffing tanks in the last season and though they are still mostly unpopular, most engage supports, tank junglers and a select toplane tanks and semi tanks (shen) are "sleeper" op picks
tahm, mundo, shen
zac, seju, amumu (low elo)
maokai (engage support)
those are one of the strongest picks right now and shouldnt be slept on
Just to be clear about what the actual boogeyman is: the state we want to avoid is games where the actions you take in the gameplay (both moment-to-moment and at a broader strategy level) don't really matter.
This can happen when burst damage is so high that the correct play becomes staying far away from enemy champions for extended periods of time, and that's why we're investigating it right now.
But it most easily happens when defense outpaces damage - hitting individual skills matters less to the outcome of a fight, so fights become more stat-check-y; because fights become more of a stat check, it's easier to know that you shouldn't fight for very extended periods of time; it's much easier to start a comeback by picking and killing a fed glass cannon who is running over a game than a fed tank or juggernaut in a tank meta.
It's funny how they're so gentle around the subject of lowering damage like it's a boogieman. No really you don't have to reassure us there won't be a "tank meta". Most people know you'd never allow that.
I'm aware that I don't have to reassure this subreddit on this topic, but yes, it really is going to be a controversial topic with the larger playerbase.
devtrackers.gg