Right cool. I’m trying to use EVERY channel available to relay feedback. I am a bit worried tbh. Especially when it comes to changes that have dumbed down the game per say. I don’t think I will be able to participate in pre-season this year, as I am not keen on playing one shot URF.
Best of luck 🤞🏻 and have a good weekend boss.
I'd suggest giving it a shot my dude, might play out differently than you'd expect
Do you think this overhaul will increase or decrease build diversity?
I suspect it varies champ to champ tbh. Most champs I'd imagine are better off than live but there are certainly some champs who might hardbind in the new system or have extremely high diversity on live relative to the average and lose out because of change.
I wonder how long riot have been already balancing the items and how long until they are in a normal state. The past couple years has been some of the best balance in terms of champ diversity(decresing recently since summer). It feels like a nightmare for their team thrown at them by the game designers
There's no way the first few patches aren't gonna be at least a little bit of a fiesta, but that's what preseason is for!
There's currently a bunch of items that do this on the PBE...hopefully they fix em to not lose stats as that feels kinda bad
We've done a bunch of tuning passes and sometimes items slip through the cracks because their recipes weren't changed or whatever. Don't worry these weird stat shifts won't last to live.
It's quite possible that the reason is it's that I'm just really bad at the game.
Maybe I'll have more success once things are live and a few balance passes are made.
Lmao. There's definitely a ton of relearning to do. Also some champs will just be weak as some benefit more or less from the new item system compared to the old. We'll make sure the tank class isn't unviable or anything come release or post release.
Leona top is low-key insane if you get a good matchup ;)
Please, I'm desperate to be able to play tanks and not go pop.
Tell our buddy working on them we want to not die, not deal more damage.
So personally I've found massive success playing tanks in internal playtests. I'm not sure what the disparity is here, might be unusual situations I'm getting into or something.
Read morei'm still apprehensive about this, especially as a player who likes practicing kiting in practice tool and feels good when my practice pays off in game (winning scuttle fights because of higher hp etc). it seems this change is trying to basically take that advantage that was earned by practice away. another reason for my apprehension is due to niche picks such as twitch jungle that basically rely 100% on kiting to clear with any semblance of healthiness, that will probably be forgotten about when tuning comes with the changes.
i guess i won't really know how it pans out until i play it in PBE/prepatch, but i just think you guys are going about this the wrong way when it comes to making jungling more approachable. as you say, it's the macro that mainly makes the jungle hard, and imo, there is no way to make that more approachable, so doing this simply harms the junglers who can already cope with the macro required for the role, and enjoy refining the micro aspects as a bonus...
I'm glad you're concerned about this stuff, it makes sure we're on top of issues that might otherwise fall through the cracks or be pushed to the side. I'd be happy to hear your experiences with clearing on some of these champs if you had the time to pop on PBE and try it out!
why are you making it so that kiting camps isn't as effective in season 11? is it to help newer players to the role? if so, i don't think that will help the issue of jungle being so unpopular. it's unpopular because you are responsible for the whole team, and if you mess up it affects everyone, not just your enemy laner. it suffers the same issue as tanking in an mmo, and I don't think it's solved by making it easier.
if that isn't the reason, why are you doing it? it just seems to lower the skillcap of something people liked to refine, and could wildly change the viability of some champions, especially niche picks such as twitch jungle, that rely heavily upon good kiting.
It's definitely true that this isn't the whole reason jungle is a hard role to get into, we're not expecting to just solve it all. Imagine there's a bunch of legos on the floor and it makes entering a room really painful, sure picking up 10% of the legos doesn't solve the problem but it does make it hurt a bit less.
Aside from that, there's still plenty of kiting and massive amounts of depth to the role (the complexity for jungle is still way higher than lanes in a macro sense imo) so its not like the role is donezo. Some of the changes (like Gromp hp restore) should actually make pathing more dynamic in the upcoming season. As with all changes we'll see how they land and revisit them if need be
Ah, maybe it's time to finally give up on Conqueror... at least Axamuk's brings back the old true damage conversion.
Thanks for being so responsive!
Axamuk's definitely feels really good on him!
I will admit i havent been keeping up due to work overload but i saw the kiting changes when they were announced and it worries me in general (i think its a bad and unnecessary change) but in particular for junglers that rely on kiting to be able to clear in a healthy state (lillia, taliyah and evelynn come to mind). In case those particular cases havent been addressed yet, is that something on your radar or something you're planning on fixing? Or does the whole camp changelist make it a non issue and im worried for no reason?
It's definitely on our radar as a 'must watch' so that they don't fall through the cracks and end up terrible.
We've not run into major issues with these kiters (they can still kite for sure) but if something ends up feeling a lot worse for them we're absolutely interested in helping out
I do enjoy watching pros pop off on it, and personally I'm doing quite fine down at my very-much-not-pro level, so at worst, I'd honestly even be okay with his jungle-ability remaining the same as it currently is. But I'm worried that the new kiting changes and health-per-burn turning into omnivamp will actually make his initial clear(s) even worse, so I figured I'd see what you guys thought!
Maybe we could get a tiny buff to his passive, for consistency?
"Damage to secondary targets executes minions below 25 health." -> "Damage to secondary targets executes minions and monsters below 25 health."
We've actually had a few playtests on him and they seemed viable, it was a fleet build iirc
I'm specifically working on the Jungle in preseason so if you have any feedback for that please do let me know!
Does that include jungle-oriented champion changes? I know you guys for some reason have shifted away from Sylas' intended roles being mid/jg to now being mid/top, but I'm not asking for him to be a meta jungler, I just don't love that his jg winrate is ~4% lower than his mid/top winrates.
It does indeed. Sadly I think there were really big pro concerns when Sylas was a flex pick between mid and jungle. I'm personally a big fan of Sylas jungle but I cant really make the call that thats his primary role.
Fwiw pros are seeing success on the champion right now so this might be one of tbose 'viable in pro but bad for everyone else' chars too
no additional feedback just because practice tool is down.
still want to reiterate though:
1) the healing within the jungle makes it feels WAY less dangerous, and that's boring.
2) make invading great again.
3) there is also something about different camps having different mechanics that added some sauce to the jungle (smite buffs). recent example is the removal of gromp double crit on first 2 hits, like that gives some personality and doesnt make the jungle bland.
Healing was actually nerfed on this deploy (omnivamp down) and there were some bugs contributing here too.
As for mechanics, do you think gromp double crit added more texture to pathing/decisions than Gromp healing based on missing HP?
Tank items continue to be trash.
There are only 2 non mythic magic resist items for tanks since Force of Nature was removed.
Frozen Heart is the only source of mana
The Mythics all have split resists again.
Not the tank item owner so I don't have context on the other stuff but I believe FoN should still be there, if it isn't it's a bug.
And look, Rioters here memeing when the game is one spark away from a Californian wildfire. Not one update on preseason items in over a week, not to mention all the Seraphine criticism that they are willingly turning a blind eye to. Closed the boards because they can't take actual criticism but will happily be paid six figures to meme on reddit with the hivemind.
Preseason PBE updated today my friend, should be lots of changes (including tons of spicy new icons) for you to try out.
I'm specifically working on the Jungle in preseason so if you have any feedback for that please do let me know!
You really have no idea who August is do you? He’s by far the most acclaimed designer, creating unique actionable ideas without the certainlyT touch of unbalancable, and by far the best champ designer at riot, jinx gnar jhin and many others are examples of top tier design and fantasy fulfillment beyond their years while maintaining peak balance.
You really have no idea who August is do you? He’s by far the most acclaimed designer, creating unique actionable ideas without the certainlyT touch of unbalancable, and by far the best champ designer at riot, jinx gnar jhin and many others are examples of top tier design and fantasy fulfillment beyond their years while maintaining peak balance.
Hey all!
This is something we're monitoring closely right now. We need to get a sense of which machete junglers are really struggling (some are very happy) to see if this needs a systemic solution or individual tuning.
Thanks for watching out for this kind of thing, that's what the PBE can help with! We will make sure your favorite junglers can still jungle.
Nice collection!
Two things y'all should know:
1) The items will have different names than the upgraded items (tooltipping tech had some bugs but we'll get there)
2) We're gonna monitor Ornn and consider adding power elsewhere if we see this is a big power down (it likely is) Maybe something to do with gaining power as he upgrades other mythics or something? Nothing is locked here, and might not happen at all. If you have any fun ideas feel free to let me know!
Fair. I am not a big fan of ominvamp. I feel it streamlines decision making. But I might be wrong.
On a positive note though boss, I like the fact the jg item disappears but I just feel over the years with timers and shit the role is just a shadow of its former self. Make invading great again
We were testing some fun stuff around stealing enemy buffs for extra power and whatnot. Nothing great came out from that but invades is still a space we're looking into.
Please add Tooth back to the Jungle item, it feels so bad being forced on to Nail. I don't care that it says "Tooth and Nail" because it's lying.
So theres a secret mechanic where your autoattacks apply a tick of the burn. That being said we're still looking into clearspeeds, especially for machete junglers.
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