It just feels bad to have every other class get an op first item(mythic) except adc, and I’m not even an adc player. It’s a little telling that every champ that can buy something other than ie is buying something else
I feel you. ADC is in a tough spot: are they the best late game champs? If so they have to be bad somewhere else. Do they get to have a good first item? Ok that means it can only be “good” and not “OP”. The alternative is they don’t outscale anyone and I’m not sure that’s allowed.
Hey Phreak, I think IE will end up being a dead item because almost every champ has a better mythic competing for that slot. What do you think about changing the IE mythic passive to increase Crit dmg for every legendary item? It would give IE something else to be a truly viable option for many champs.
No, Galeforce is just OP.
IE doesn't need even more of its power locked behind 5 item builds.
Yeah honestly I don’t get why Riot is doubling down so hard on the mythic items. Just get rid of the concept already. It isn’t fun to have your champ’s viability be completely reliant on what mythics are strong.
Having everything be legendary is so much more fun. You can mix and match items way more and it allows more variety in item builds.
Outside of not allowing you to buy IE and Galeforce together how exactly does the current mythic system limit ADC item choice? Everything is stackable outside of situations where you already couldn't (IE + Rageblade = ????)
This, galeforce just needs nerfs. Its really stupid how strong Phreak/Riot decided to overbuff it cause idiots thought IE was so strong galeforce would be unusable. The dash alone on it is strong, now it's also a NUKE of an active.
Edit: also it's probably stronger 1-3 items cause the active ain't RNG based and it gives attack speed which is huge early game for dps.
I mean to be clear this feedback was universal from almost literally everyone.
It'd be equivalent at this point to me saying, "Nah, ADC isn't actually overpowered and pros are wrong to play around bot lane right now. Maybe they'll sort it out by Worlds."
Feels like that's not a great content strategy in either the Galeforce on launch or a theoretical "don't nerf ADC" case.
Read morePeople buy ie when then are ahead
It's not that, you and the person you replied to are misinterpreting the stats. Guinsoo's on average for Twitch is built at 19 minutes, IE at 25 minutes. Meaning Guinsoo's is typically built as 2nd item, and IE more commonly as 3rd. The later into a build an item is, the higher its winrate will be as you are more likely to get deep into your build while ahead than while behind, so the games when you're behind don't get into 3rd item IE's stats as much as the games where you're ahead do. This is called survivorship bias. It also means that more expensive items also suffer from this, as when you're comparing a 2700 gold item vs a 3400 gold item, the 2700 gold item is more likely to have been completed in losing games than the 3400 one, meaning its winrate will be less inflated.
Every item winrate suffers from survivorship bias to a very certain extent, even first items, but you have to absolutely take it int...
Two extra notes here:
Sample size matters. A decent rule of thumb is 10k games gives you +/- 1% win rate and anything that doesn't exceed that mold is statistically insignificant.
Also, popularity matters. On average, unpopular builds have inflated win rates because players who are smart enough to look into the shop for their items (as opposed to using rec items or Blitz or whatever) will tend to be better at their champion.
Then there's some further things like the ability for players to troll their builds. What if Hurricane is bad on IE builds but good on Rageblade? That doesn't mean IE is necessarily worse than Rageblade on a 3-item build, just means players haven't been building correctly.
Anyways, overall IE is preforming pretty well. Galeforce is still OP, especially on Yasuo/Yone and now that there's enough data on champion item builds, we can act in a more appropriate manner.
thanks for making some fun offmeta itemization possible.
Happy to help :)
Okay, that should be changed...
Her designer was working on that today. I expect that to be in for .12
so statik shiv on rumble going to be a thing now?
Statikk Shiv on every champion is the intended interaction, tbh. Why should ADCs have all the fun?
u/PhreakRiot, on the topic of Kraken Slayer, couldn't you have done damage type adaptive based on whether the champion has more AD or AP? Or is it not sustainable in through items?
That would by itself solve the issue of Kalista and Jinx cause they never would buy enough AP to turn the damage type into magic meanwhile it would kill the item on Kayle/Teemo/TF.
I think adaptive items aren’t a great idea. I think there is a lot of value in items being consistent in what they do. I say this acknowledging kraken has had three damage types in three weeks.
I'm sometimes confused by your comments because I'm not clear exactly where the designers' responsibilities end. Do you guys write code too? Wdym "I didn't have time to fix it"?
Designers write the scripts that tell items, buffs, spells, etc. how to function. Sometimes we need engineering support to create new scripts.
It didn't have to be "my" bug but crit items are the project I've been working on, so it's not exactly wrong to assign it to me.
I’m confused by the blurb about the Kraken changes. “Crit marksmen were doing too much damage over long fights so Kraken is becoming physical but doing more damage, because we want to buff it.” It reads to me that they’re trying to decrease marksmen damage by buffing Kraken slayer?
Edit: maybe it means to say Crit marksmen are dealing too much magic damage?
Was meant to say magic damage, yeah.
As fun as it is to 'Reddit Knows Balance', it isn't like the balance team is right often either. Both of them are wildly wrong very often, turns out the game is hard to predict.
Inb4 someone says the balance team is often right, lel.
Yeah those opinions were coming from inside the house, too.
Fwiw I was also told Shiv was going to be underpowered. They were right.
The rageblade, kraken bug wasn't mentioned in the bug fixes. Are they not gonning to fix it in this patch?
I believe the kraken rageblade interaction is disabled for the time being. I asked the designer who created the interaction to disable it since I didn’t have time to fix it correctly. But I’m not 100% that it got in.
Do you think its reasonable to change her passive/Q interaction with wards/traps? Either works. That could potentially lower the pro tilt if its ever needed.
Essentially just removing an auto-reset specifically vs wards. She's already considered safe, and this interaction currently only adds to her safety, realistically. Completely unneeded power.
It’s such a small piece of power I think it does more to hurt feels than actually to do anything meaningful for game balance.
Could reduce effectiveness of on-hits for her Q to 75%
Most of the on-hit items are already pretty bad on her, so them being a worse option won't change much, but it'll address this build in the meantime.
The only kinda unintended change would be to runaan's, and the on-hit is getting nerfed soon IIRC, so dealing 11 on-hit damage instead of 15 shouldn't change things drastically, considering that's not why she buys it.
Also possible, sure. She already has a sorta anti-synergy since her attacks per second is capped. Further AS turns into AD, which only synergizes with crit. Obviously this isn’t enough.
Still though, I suspect there is room to just remove some of her “free” flat damage that doesn’t scale with item purchases. Ratios could be compensated where needed.
Three day weekend vibes
I’m on PTO today also
Are you just getting up or going to sleep, funny how that matters though
The first replies were going to sleep. These are getting up.
It’s 6am and Phreak is on r/leagueoflegends sorting by new, that’s how you know he’s a real enjoyer of this sub and not just here for PR.
My sleep schedule is bad. Giving me positive feedback for this isn’t helping.
I'm genuinely curious, but do you guys ever plan on removing the Q sheen interaction? It'd definitely put a huge nail into the coffin for trinity builds. Although maybe it'd be cool if her zap gave her a sheen proc since that's technically an ability, so she'd have to weave the zaps with Q to use trinity.
I’d defer to her champ designer but it could be done. I don’t have a super strong opinion except that I kinda dislike turning it off. It breaks baseline expectation in a pretty weird way.
It kind of is with titanic hydra.
Technically correct, the best kind of correct 👍🏼
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